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Material On Getting Started - James Bond - 2010-06-06
Hi Everyone,
I just started learning Japanese and am very excited. However, there is so much to learn from! I am already purchasing RTK but I have read about other things that I can't understand what they are like, what is UBJG?
So I was just wandering if someone could get me off on the right track to learning Japanese? And of course, I want to read, write, speak and listen. I have already taught myself a second language, so this will be my third. I can't wait to get started.
Thanks
-Bond
BTW this forum is awesome
Material On Getting Started - SammyB - 2010-06-06
http://forum.koohii.com/showthread.php?tid=5110
http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/blog/all-japanese-all-the-time-ajatt-how-to-learn-japanese-on-your-own-having-fun-and-to-fluency
That should keep you busy for a while. Good luck!
EDIT: UBJG is a grammar textbook called Understanding Basic Japanese Grammar.
Material On Getting Started - Reviewed - 2010-06-06
Nukemarine's comment containing convienient compilation: http://forum.koohii.com/showthread.php?tid=5110
Edit: Ninjaed!
Material On Getting Started - TaylorSan - 2010-06-07
Welcome Bond!
頑張って！
Material On Getting Started - James Bond - 2010-06-07
Thank you all very much =]
Another one of my problems is that I do not understand JLPT or RTK decks?
Also, I no one minds me asking questions, do you even pronounce the kanji in japanese? Or is it an unspoken literature? I know its a weird question, but when I see a kanji and the english definition, it just leads me to believe there is no spoken word for that kanji. So basically you are learning a whole other language with Japanese. I know this is wrong, but I am trying to show you all the way I am thinking so it can be corrected easier. Plus, what exactly is the Kana? And I have noticed kanji is mixed with the other two alphabets. These are questions I just cannot find answers to sadly and understanding basically how their writing system works (I believe they all three work together) then I will be able to learn easier.
Thank again, great to be here!
BTW, I purchased RTK today!
How does one even study from this book? Do you all write down the kanji as well as just looking at it?
Material On Getting Started - RisuMiso - 2010-06-07
Decks refer to groups of flashcards on a digital program (spaced repetition software/system - SRS). Anki is an srs program for example.
Kana refers to hiragana ひらがな and katakana カタカナ. If I remember correctly there are 46 characters for each. Learn these first IMO.
Kanji (漢字）of course can be read (through memorization not phonetically). Kana is used to write the readings of each kanji. 銀行-ぎんこう-ginkou-bank So each kanji has different readings and most of them have multiple readings. In a sentence like 公園に行きましたか。kouen ni ikimashita ka. You have kanji and kana. The kanji is for words, and the kana is used for conjugation endings, particles, and words.
To study RTK either use this webpage for your srs, or use anki and download the premade RTK1+3 deck. Even if you use anki you should use this website for your stories.
I hope that answers some of your questions. I'm sure other people on here who are far better at Japanese and linguistics could give you a better definition than I did though.
Material On Getting Started - Asriel - 2010-06-07
ひらがな and かたかな
hiragana and katakana look simple compared to their good friends, the Kanji:
漢字、電気、中毒、現像
Hiragana has 46 (?) characters, as does Katakana.
They are phonetic, so you always know what sound to make when pronouncing them, ie: あ = 'a' and た= 'ta'
Whereas kanji can have multiple readings (usually 2 or 3). Sometimes it's pronounced one way, sometimes another, depending on the word. You can break down kanji words into hiragana, if you so choose:
電気 = でんき = 'denki' = electricity
The number of kanji that exist is quite large. However, the Japanese Government decided that only 1945 (more this year?) are required to be "literate" in Japanese.
Why do they have all 3?
Kanji is used for words (in order for them to be read faster?).
Katakana is generally used for words from other languages and sound effects.
These aren't hard rules, just common observations.
Hiragana is the most versatile, and can be used for anything. Words (even normally kanji words), verb endings, particles. As a beginner, it should probably be the first thing to knock out of the way. Then Katakana, then enter into the wide world of kanji.
JLPT = Japanese Language Proficiency Test. It gives you a piece of paper saying "I can pass a multiple choice test that supposedly means I know Japanese"
Yeah, if you can pass JLPT level 1, you're probably pretty good, but just passing the test doesn't mean you're native-good.
I probably repeated some stuff, but perhaps I said something useful. I'm not sure.
Good luck!
Material On Getting Started - Tobberoth - 2010-06-07
No one gave you a longer example so I'll go ahead.
This is hiragana:
これがひらがなです
Here is the same thing, but written in katakana:
コレガヒラガナデス
As you can see, both systems are very simple compared to kanji, but they don't look the same. In the beginning it might be hard to differentiate at times (in the middle of a text) but as you get used to it, katakana sticks out in a text really well (like ALL CAPS in English).
Material On Getting Started - Asriel - 2010-06-07
James Bond Wrote:How does one even study from this book? Do you all write down the kanji as well as just looking at it?I missed this part.
You can read the introduction, as it may or may not be good (I don't recall).
At first you'll think it's really weird, like you're not learning anything.
He gives you the certain 'primitives,' which all combine to make one kanji, to which he assigns a keyword. Your part, is to get to the point where you read the keyword, recall the "story," which should, in turn, give you all the "parts" (primitives) in the story, hopefully in order, which will in turn, lead you to remember how the kanji was formed, and thus, how to write it.
胆, "Gallbladder," kanji 31, is a good example, I believe.
The parts that make it up are 月, and 旦.
旦, is made up of 日, day (sun), and 一, one (ground, floor, horizon).
With 旦, Nightbreak, you could read it and your story could be "When the SUN rises above the HORIZON, you know that it is NIGHTBREAK"
Then, getting back to 胆、you have 月 and 旦. In many contexts in Heisig's stories, 月 is also used to be a 'flesh' or 'meat' or something along those lines.
So GALLBLADDER: The piece of FLESH (part of the body) that leaks fluid at NIGHTBREAK.
Note: To make your journey learning Kanji better/faster, I suggest looking into the "Movie Method." Basically, you assign movies to each of the readings of the kanji, and add it as another primitive to the story you make up, so you can learn to read the kanji much faster
The stories I have given are weak, and I just thought of them off the top of my head -- don't use them. I would highly suggest reading through the stories people have submitted on this site, perhaps modifying them to suit your needs.
Once you think you know them well enough to remember them the next day, put them into an SRS (I like the one on this site, it's all set up
) and don't think about them until when they come up tomorrow.This is the counter intuitive part at the beginning. You will want to study them so you don't forget. Don't. The SRS makes sure it goes into your long-term memory, so spending your time studying things that you already know will not get you anywhere.
The next day, do your daily SRS reviews, if you forgot some -- be honest, hit "not remembered" and re-study them that day. It's no big deal. Once that's out of the way, you continue on with learning some more kanji the way you did the day before.
It will be fun at times, blazing through kanji and coming up with stories. It will be terrible some times (usually around number 1400-1800 ish? You just want to be done, but there's still a lot to go...)
But once you're done with it, and if you kept up with the community here, you'll most likely have developed a trust in the SRS system, as well as wonderful new ideas on how to continue your Japanese study.
That's the wonderful thing about RtK. Not only does it give you a wonderful system of demystifying Kanji, but it leads people to this site -- full of excellent motivated people, who willingly and freely discuss their methods of learning Japanese.
---now that you've been sucked in, you can't leave---