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+--- Thread: Stroke count for Korea (/thread-384.html)
Stroke count for Korea - brose - 2007-02-17
Some sources, including Halpern, give the count stoke for frame 1647 Korea 韓 as 17 while Heisig and some others have it as 18. The difference is in the sunglasses, with the second and third strokes combined into one stroke in Halpern. Can someone find out which is right? Note that Halpern agrees with Heisig on all the other kanji containing "locket".
Stroke count for Korea - JimmySeal - 2007-02-19
I'm checking my Obunsha 漢和辞典 (printed 1992), which is the one found all over my school, and it lists 韓 as 17 strokes (9 strokes for 韋), but 偉 as 12 strokes (10 strokes for 韋), with an 11-stroke version listed as a 旧字体
The reason I surmised for this (and which I just found explained in the dictionary) is that all 常用漢字 containing 韋 have been re-classified as having 10 strokes in 韋, while non-常用漢字 have been left with 9 strokes in 韋 (with an L-shaped stroke at the bottom just like in 区). (韓 is non-常用漢字) Heisig usually tends to deal with more universal concepts of stroke count.
You'll never be considered wrong for writing 韓 with 18 strokes, but it seems that officially the number is 17.
When I get home in 7 hours I'll check the 漢字源 on my electronic dictionary to see if it says something different.
Stroke count for Korea - Ricardo - 2007-02-19
This kind of discussion always raises me a question: where/what is the "official source for kanji stroke counts"?
I think I read something about this a long time ago, but my memory is failing me (maybe it's getting full packed with stories and mnemonics, and somethings had to go in order to leave some room)...
Stroke count for Korea - JimmySeal - 2007-02-19
I'm not sure if there is one, but Monbusho puts out a reference dictionary for the kanji kentei that has about 6000 characters. I think that's about as close to official as you can get.
Stroke count for Korea - brose - 2007-02-20
Thanks for that-- your explanation makes a lot of sense.
Stroke count for Korea - Katsuo - 2007-02-20
Heisig "locket" is radical number 178 "nameshigawa". The standard form of this radical has 9 strokes but there is a variant form with 10 strokes. (Halpern refs 2268 & 2287).
In Japanese dictionaries, "locket" usually gets classified as 9 strokes when it is the radical for a particular kanji, and mostly as 10 strokes when it is part of a kanji but not its radical.
"Korea" is the only kanji in the Heisig books where "locket" is the radical.
Stroke count for Korea - JimmySeal - 2007-02-20
Well I went and checked 漢字源 which has approx. 6000 kanji (All of the JIS Level 2 kanji), and it has 11 kanji with the 韋 primitive:
韋偉圍幃葦諱韓韜緯違衛
in this dictionary, all of them are counted as having 10 strokes in the 韋 primitive except for 圍, which has 9 (total stroke count 12). I believe that this is because 圍 is the only one that's not an actual modern kanji, but an old form of 囲.
So it seems that this dictionary has updated all kanji, and not just joyo ones to the newer counting method, though it has this note at the bottom of the entry for 韋:
＜参考＞
常用漢字の一部として使われるときは「ヰ」を四画に数えて全体を十画とする。
<Note>
When used as part of a Joyo-Kanji, "ヰ" is counted as 4 strokes, for a total of 10 strokes.