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The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-05-23

Groot Wrote:2. In the very next bubble, Jumbo seems to say something disparaging about the lazy guy who isn't coming because of the heat. Jumbo says:

やっぱタノだー

I peeked at a translation that says this means "He sucks", or some such. But danged if I can't figure that out from my various dictionaries!
I just checked my copy and you've made a transcription error here too, I think. It should be
Quote:やっぱダメだー
As Caivano says, やっぱ is a short spoken variant of やっぱり, so the meaning is something like "he's useless (and this incident confirms what I already thought about him)" only with a register rather closer to "he sucks" :-)

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-05-23

IceCream Wrote:
Taurus Wrote:
IceCream Wrote:ほしいだけ本が買えたらどんなにいいだろう。
Same goes for this sentence. I really struggle with だけ-constructions it seems :/
だけに／だけあって is no problem, just だけ alone gives me headaches -.-

This one probably is "as much as": When / if i buy a book i want as much as this (This Much), it's gonna be well good.
And I thought this was something like, 'How good would it be if I could buy the book(s) that I want.'
mm, yeah, i was assuming it isn't a literal question though, cos of どんなにいいだろう... in which case, you can say either with the same kinda meaning, but "how good would it be" is quite a friends / new york type construction as far as i know (im british). Sorry for any confusion!
Edit: wait, why is it "could buy"? and where does the だけ come in in that case?
So my vote here is for "Wouldn't it be great if you could buy as many books as you wanted?", because I think this is like 好きなだけ "as many/much as you like" and できるだけ "as many/much as you can". In support I quote this fragment of dialogue from Doraemon gleaned from google's cache:
Quote:「どら焼き、ほしいだけ買うよ？ ただ、代わりにコンピューターペンシルをだしてほしいな～」 「うっ……ほしいだけ？」 「うん、何個でも、何十個でも」
The 日本語文型辞典 actually has a section on the X~たらどんなに~か pattern which it glosses as
Quote:Xの実現を強く望むが、実際にはそれが不可能なことをとても残念に思う気持ちを表す
(it has more to say than that if you have a copy to hand.) It's "could buy" because this is the 可能形 of 買う.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Groot - 2010-05-23

Quote:I just checked my copy and you've made a transcription error here too, I think. It should be

やっぱダメだー

As Caivano says, やっぱ is a short spoken variant of やっぱり, so the meaning is something like "he's useless (and this incident confirms what I already thought about him)" only with a register rather closer to "he sucks" :-)
Ah, thanks! I think when I was reading the manga, I did read ダメ correctly -- I just made a typo transcribing it into here. Although, as I look at it again, I wonder if the katakana helps supply the "register" you mention. Smile

Anyway, it was the first word that baffled me, and your explanation clears it up. Thanks!

Interestingly, I've had very few problems with the first volume of Yotsuba since these examples. I read the next couple parts almost entirely without the help of a dictionary. There's hope!

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - FooSoft - 2010-05-23

Hey guys, I have two sentences that I would like to get a little bit of insight on:

「 嬉しそうな恥ずかしそうな…そんな顔で涙を流す藤林。それを見ながら、俺は穏やかな気持ちになるのがわかった。」
What does のがわかった add the meaning? How would it be different from just saying 穏やかな気持ちになった?

「やがてクルクルと回っていた惑星が、それぞれ左右に分かれ始め、数回点滅しては消えていく。」
What is は doing here?

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - skeeter3 - 2010-05-26

Hey everyone!　I'm having a little trouble with a sentence in the book I'm working through.

あなたが、四つになるまで、あそんだ森や川です。

I understand the 「あなたが｝」。　The part with 「四つになるまで」　means something about four things, but I'm not sure about the になるまで part. I suspect it's a particle combination I've not yet been exposed to.　Last, the part about 「あそんだ森や川です。」　means　something about the forest and the river. Overall, I　can figure little pieces out, but can't put it all together. Thanks a bunch!

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - yudantaiteki - 2010-05-26

FooSoft Wrote:Hey guys, I have two sentences that I would like to get a little bit of insight on:

「 嬉しそうな恥ずかしそうな…そんな顔で涙を流す藤林。それを見ながら、俺は穏やかな気持ちになるのがわかった。」
What does のがわかった add the meaning? How would it be different from just saying 穏やかな気持ちになった?
It adds "I understand X" -- I'm not sure exactly what you're asking here.

Quote:「やがてクルクルと回っていた惑星が、それぞれ左右に分かれ始め、数回点滅しては消えていく。」
What is は doing here?
XてはY is a grammar element; you may find it under ては in a dictionary....although I'm not entirely sure how it's being used here, so I may be wrong.

skeeter3:
Quote:あなたが、四つになるまで、あそんだ森や川です。
Is that really how the punctuation is? That's rather odd punctuation; normally the sentence would be written without any commas.

Everything up to 森や川 is a modifying sentence describing what kind of forests and rivers. The modifier is あなたが四つになるまであそんだ ("You played until you were four years old"). So the whole thing works out to "[These are?] the forests and rivers you played in up until you were four years old."

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-05-26

yudantaiteki Wrote:
FooSoft Wrote:「やがてクルクルと回っていた惑星が、それぞれ左右に分かれ始め、数回点滅しては消えていく。」
What is は doing here?
XてはY is a grammar element; you may find it under ては in a dictionary....although I'm not entirely sure how it's being used here, so I may be wrong.
Mmm, it didn't quite seem to fit in with the ては as I thought I understood it and as described in my grammar reference (which is about actions that repeat, like 1ページ読んでは顔をあげて窓の外を見ている), which is why I didn't comment earlier. However, my guess, and it is definitely a guess, is that 数回点滅して消えていく would be (just) saying that all the planets flicker and then go out, whereas 数回点滅しては消えていく is saying that the flicker-and-go-out action is repeated, ie they flicker and go out one after another. [my google-fu tells me we are definitely talking about planets plural here...] But I could be way off base; I'd love to know the real answer :-)

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - skeeter3 - 2010-05-26

Thanks for the help! Yes, that's the exact punctuation. I've never seen many other Japanese sources punctuated like that either. It's a children's book, meant for about 3rd grade kids, on the life of Abraham Lincoln. Picked it up at the Book Off in NYC a few days back. Thanks again!

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - FooSoft - 2010-05-27

yudantaiteki Wrote:
FooSoft Wrote:Hey guys, I have two sentences that I would like to get a little bit of insight on:

「 嬉しそうな恥ずかしそうな…そんな顔で涙を流す藤林。それを見ながら、俺は穏やかな気持ちになるのがわかった。」
What does のがわかった add the meaning? How would it be different from just saying 穏やかな気持ちになった?
It adds "I understand X" -- I'm not sure exactly what you're asking here.
Thanks for the reply. I understand the "I understand X" part, I guess it just seems weird that he "understands that he is becoming calm." I'm probably just trying to read too much into this.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-05-27

FooSoft Wrote:
yudantaiteki Wrote:
FooSoft Wrote:Hey guys, I have two sentences that I would like to get a little bit of insight on:

「 嬉しそうな恥ずかしそうな…そんな顔で涙を流す藤林。それを見ながら、俺は穏やかな気持ちになるのがわかった。」
What does のがわかった add the meaning? How would it be different from just saying 穏やかな気持ちになった?
It adds "I understand X" -- I'm not sure exactly what you're asking here.
Thanks for the reply. I understand the "I understand X" part, I guess it just seems weird that he "understands that he is becoming calm." I'm probably just trying to read too much into this.
わかる and 'understand' don't overlap exactly. I took the meaning here as probably better translated as 'I realised that...' than 'I understood that'.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Manske - 2010-05-30

Hello, everyone. I was going through the children's book さるかにがっせん and came across this sentence:

かには かきを とろうと おもいますが つるんと おちて きに のぼろことが できません。

What's throwing me off here is the "つるんとおちて" clause modifying き. I know what it's saying, but why does it work?

1. Why is おちる in -te form?
2. Can someone explain how the つる + ん + と construction works?

Thanks, and sorry for the noob question.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-05-31

Manske Wrote:かには かきを とろうと おもいますが つるんと おちて きに のぼろことが できません。

What's throwing me off here is the "つるんとおちて" clause modifying き. I know what it's saying, but why does it work?

1. Why is おちる in -te form?
2. Can someone explain how the つる + ん + と construction works?

Thanks, and sorry for the noob question.
1. つるんとおちて is *not* modifying き here: つるんと おちて and きに のぼろことが できません are both at the same 'level' of the sentence. This is the very common use of the -te form to link two sentences (often translated with plain old "and"). Check a grammar reference like the Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar for details, but basically the sentences are linked here because the first one is the reason for the second.
(You can tell おちて isn't modifying き because it's the wrong form -- to do that it would have to be おちる or おちった or some other plain form ending.)

2. You've misparsed つるんと : つるん is one of those onomatopoeia words which takes と. It's not in any of the online dictionaries I checked, but the Green Goddess says つるんと is the same as つるりと, which is all about slipperiness and sliding (also not in EDICT but it is in the goo.ne.jp dictionaries). Here it's modifying おちる to describe the way in which the crab falls down (ie by sliding down rather than just plain falling out of the tree).

[ETA: I've submitted つるりと and つるんと to EDICT so they'll show up there at some point.]

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - sheetz - 2010-05-31

What does マジでタルい mean? I've googled it but can't figure it from context.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - yudantaiteki - 2010-05-31

Are you sure it's not ダルい?

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - sheetz - 2010-05-31

I'm working on a translation for Detective Conan and it turns up in the upper left hand frame of this page;

http://hi.baidu.com/conanheiji/album/item/e7e57e4c0c2c53c2d72afc18.html#IMG=e7e57e4c0c2c53c2d72afc18

A search on Yahoo turns up several hazy examples like:

数学マジでタルい。
最近マジでタルい。
このくっつきかたはマジでタルい。

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Tobberoth - 2010-05-31

tarui is just a different way of writing darui.

http://dic.yahoo.co.jp/dsearch?enc=UTF-8&p=%E3%81%9F%E3%82%8B%E3%81%84&dtype=0&stype=0&dname=0na&pagenum=1&index=13526711680300

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - sheetz - 2010-05-31

Awesome! Thanks!

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - ems573 - 2010-06-02

Anyone know the difference between 建った and 建てた? Have seen these two different things, have assumed them to be identical, but rather confused by it. I mean, the infinitive is 建てる.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-06-02

ems573 Wrote:Anyone know the difference between 建った and 建てた? Have seen these two different things, have assumed them to be identical, but rather confused by it. I mean, the infinitive is 建てる.
建つ and 建てる are a pair of related but different verbs, one of which is transitive and the other intransitive. (You might find the Japanese terms 自動詞 and 他動詞 less confusing). Roughly, transitive (他動詞) verbs take an を-marked object, and intransitive (自動詞) do not. (There are a few cases where an apparently intransitive verb takes を but you can probably ignore them for the moment. Also the を clause of a transitive verb might have been omitted if it is obvious from context.)

親の土地に子供が家を建てた -- the child built a house on the parents' land
7ヶ月で家が建った -- the house was built in seven months

English generally uses the same verb in both situations but Japanese does not. You'll find you encounter a lot of these pairs (決まる/決める;割れる/割る;回る/回す and on and on), and it's worth getting them straight. EDICT (and thus rikaichan) mark them with "vi" and "vt"; other dictionaries should also distinguish them.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - ems573 - 2010-06-02

Alright, thanks for clearing up that misconception bro.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - SammyB - 2010-06-02

I'm a bit confused as to why I sometimes see なった or なる　when I would normally expect だった　or だ...

E.g. from Core2000:

その試合は残念な結果になった

Is the meaning really that the result of the game became disappointing/unfortunate?

The translation given is "The result of the game was disappointing".. Couldn't you just have "その試合は残念な結果だった" to express that?

I realise it's probably idiomatic because I also いい経験になった　and 勉強になった quite frequently, but don't understand the nuance.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Pauline - 2010-06-03

SammyB Wrote:その試合は残念な結果になった

Is the meaning really that the result of the game became disappointing/unfortunate?

The translation given is "The result of the game was disappointing".. Couldn't you just have "その試合は残念な結果だった" to express that?
Isn't it the difference between "that game became a disappointing result (expecting another result)" and "that game was a disappointing result (expecting something else than that game)"?

Edit: Grammar

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - nest0r - 2010-06-03

SammyB Wrote:I'm a bit confused as to why I sometimes see なった or なる　when I would normally expect だった　or だ...

E.g. from Core2000:

その試合は残念な結果になった

Is the meaning really that the result of the game became disappointing/unfortunate?

The translation given is "The result of the game was disappointing".. Couldn't you just have "その試合は残念な結果だった" to express that?

I realise it's probably idiomatic because I also いい経験になった　and 勉強になった quite frequently, but don't understand the nuance.
From Rikaichan:

成る なる
為る なる
(v5r,vi,uk) to become; to get; to grow; to be; to reach; to attain; to result in; to prove to be; to consist of; to be composed of; to succeed; to be complete; to change into; (P)

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Codexus - 2010-06-03

I think 残念な結果だった is perfectly OK too.

But we wouldn't get the nuance that the speaker was hoping his team would win and then the game result turned out to be a disappointment. You could just say it was disappointing, but it can be weird if everything you say is said dispassionately like your just listing a bunch of objective facts.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Verdana - 2010-06-03

I'm reading a book called 泣いちゃいそうだよ and while I can follow the story, I have trouble understanding the title. What does ちゃい do in that sentence? What does the sentence mean?

Thanks.