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The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-18

chochajin Wrote:駅の構内は終日禁煙になっております。皆様のご協力をお願いします。

Why is "natte orimasu" used here and what exactly does it mean?
I know that "oru" is a hubmle form of "iru" and that "ni naru" means "becomes ..", but what does "natte iru/oru" mean then?
Smoking within the station WILL BE forbidden? Why can't you use just "narimasu" then?
駅の構内は終日禁煙です。would work just fine. If you swap です with になっています, it sounds a little softer than the です version because なっています is like you're describing/reporting what you just observed while です is like you're stating a cold fact that can't be changed. Hence the なっています version is softer and politer. になっております is even politer.

禁煙になります can also works as a politer command or a request. But it can sound like smoking in a similar place is totally ok but the place in question is exceptional or it's temporary. I think the なっています version is better when the speaker is talking about a public space in a train station because pretty much every station is like that and it's not temporary. For example, ここから先は禁煙になります is good if it's a sign in a bar to indicate a certain area where it's illegal to smoke for safety reasons.
chochajin Wrote:「日記」と「日誌」は違います。「日記」というのは個人が自分のためにつけるもので、「日誌」というのは会社や学校などでみんなのためにつけるものです。

What exactly does "tsukeru" mean here and what would be the right kanji to use?
It's a verb that means "write" and collocates with 日記, 日誌, 手帳 and so on. 書く is ok, but it would be less idiomatic.
chochajin Wrote:空輸するとなると輸送費がとても高くつきます。

"suru to naru to" - uhm, what? And I checked it this time, it's not a typo.
It's not special at all. It's just a combination of 空輸する + なる + 輸送費が... with the usual particle to connect them. The nuance added by なる is that the speaker doesn't think it's good, doesn't want to do it, thinks it's surprising, or something along those lines. The meaning of なる here is "end up" etc., and it often carries a negative connotation when it's "verbとなると," though it's entirely depends on context.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-18

@magamo: Awesome! Again, thanks so much! *bows* (〃⌒ー⌒)/どもっ♪

会場にはあふれるほど、ギターを持った若者が集まっていた。

Grammar point: ほど
I couldn't find any additional information in any of my grammar dictionaries as they cover other aspects of "hodo", so I want to make sure I understood the usage of "hodo" here.

So many young people with guitars were gathering, that the hall almost was overflowed. (sorry for my bad English, but I think you still get it ..)

子供をなくしたご両親の悲しみが痛いほどわかる。

The pain of parents who lost their child(ren) I can understand so much that it hurts.

久しぶりに国の母の声を聞いて、うれしくて泣きたいほどだった。

When I heard my mother's voice (who's living in the countryside?!) again after a long time, I was so happy that I wanted to cry.

And a different use of "hodo":
仲のいい友達と旅行するほど楽しいことはない。
There's nothing more fun than travelling with a very good friend.

Did I get this grammar point right?

Thanks again Smile

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-18

chochajin Wrote:Did I get this grammar point right?
The translation of the latter use of ほど is all right. But I can't tell if you understand the first three examples correctly. It's rhetoric/metaphor, so it's kind of exaggeration. Here is an example where English translation can illustrate what ほど is doing:

死ぬほど疲れた = I'm dead tired.

I think this kind of Xほど is a metaphorical use of "to the extent that X is true," so maybe you can understand it as "to the extent that X is almost true."

国 is your hometown you reminisce about/have nostalgic feelings for. If you still live in your birthplace, you don't have your 国 per se.

Oh, and the kanji for つける as in 日記をつける is 付ける.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Nyanda - 2010-02-18

magamo Wrote:But I can't tell if you understand the first three examples correctly.
I think they understood perfectly fine.
Perhaps the English sentences could be re-ordered to make them sound a little more natural (Maybe this is why you weren't sure?) but I can see they have the correct understanding.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - yudantaiteki - 2010-02-18

chochajin Wrote:駅の構内は終日禁煙になっております。皆様のご協力をお願いします。

Why is "natte orimasu" used here and what exactly does it mean?
I know that "oru" is a hubmle form of "iru" and that "ni naru" means "becomes ..", but what does "natte iru/oru" mean then?
In addition to what magamo said, this use of "orimasu" in reference to an inanimate or abstract object is not humble, it's what JSL calls "neutral polite". These are expressions that don't honor or humble anyone, but are just polite to whoever is reading/listening -- in other words, it's like a souped-up version of です/ます. ございます and でございます are also neutral-polite. These neutral-polite phrases are mostly used in the fixed speech of clerks, waiters, and on information signs and the like. They're not very often used in standard speech, even polite speech.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-18

@Nyanda
The point is that it's like a flood of people aren't literally a flood. A plethora of typos aren't related to blood. But ほど can also be literal, and actually the 泣きたいほど sentence may be closer to the literal sense. So I was thinking she might be thinking it's always the same as "so X that Y" and applying the English structure freely to make sense.

The reason I thought she might not understand it correctly is that it seemed to me that, in her three translations, grammatical portions of original Japanese sentences that are translated into X and Y (and other parts) in the "so X that Y" structure are inconsistent. For instance, the translation of 久しぶりに国の母の声を聞いて、うれしくて泣きたいほどだった was more like a translation of 久しぶりに国の母の声を聞いたときうれしくて、泣きたいほどだった in a word-for-word (grammar-for-grammar?) translation sense, i.e., if the rule used in the first sentence (the あふれるほど one) were applied the same way, "Clause+うれしくて泣きたいほどだった" would be "...so touching/emotional/whatever that I almost cried (or wanted to cry?) happy tears." I wasn't really sure why she thought "happy (apparently it's from うれしい)" would be modified by "so" while in the other examples she took many/much out of thin air to make sense. In fact, the original version means pretty much the same as "久しぶりに国の母の声を聞いて、うれし泣きしそうなほどだった." If you apply the "so...that..." structure the same way as the first example, I guess you'd get "I hadn't heard her voice for so many years that I almost cried happy tears."

So, while you could say 痛いほどわかる is "I understand so much that it hurts," it's just "I can relate to them so much" or, if you want to use the "so...that..." structure, "I can relate to them so much I am hurting. (Note that I'm abusing the coincidence that "hurt" and "痛い" can be figuratively used in a similar way here. If they weren't similar in this regard, you wouldn't be able to use "so...that..." this way to make as much sense as this.)"

Anyway, I guess it's not that important as long as you don't get a completely different meaning.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-18

Thanks again. Maybe I can grasp the nuances of "hodo" in this cause better after a while. As long as it's not wrong, I guess it's okay Smile
Also, please not that sometimes my translations might sound a bit strange, but that's mainly because my native language is not English.

今くらいの日本語ではビジネスの世界では通用しない。

KiC sentence again.
I can't use my current Japanese in the business world????

時間と労力をかけた割には、成果がなかった。

While I think I can grasp the basic idea of this sentence, I'm not sure how to translate it.
The result stands in no relation to the time and effort we put into it. (more lit. would probably be something like Compared to the time and effort we put into it, there wasn't a corresponging result.)

この問題は重要な問題なのできちんとした話し合いの場を設けましょう。

I do understand this sentence, but I've been wanting to ask about this for a while now.
The construction "adv.+した" - how and when is it used?
Could you just use きちんと without the した in this sentence as well? Does it have a special nuance?

チームで仕事をしていると、連絡をよくしておかないと、仕事が重複してしまう。

The use of "しておく" here emphasizes that it should be done in advance?

Again sorry for my bad translations. It's really hard for me to put my thoughts into correct English while still struggling with a translation into my mother tongue *sigh*

I'm sorry for asking so many questions, but it really helps me to understand things better now, so I'll probably keep asking from now on. よろしくお願いします。（；^ω^）

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-19

駅を中心にたくさんの商店が集まっている。

中心に So the station is being made into the center, right?
A lot of shops are concentrated here with the station being the center.
OK?

うちに cannot be used when the noun is an event, e.g.
授業のうちに、会議のうちに is not possible, but there's this one example sentence in one of my books:
休みのうちによく寝ておきます。 (I slept a lot during my vacation.)
So vacation doesn't count as event, because it's not just a short period of time, but a few days or even weeks?

山本さんは中国語が上手なおかげで、いい仕事が見つかったそうです。

Does "そうです" refer here to the whole sentence?
Is it: It seems that thanks to his good Chinese ability, Mr. Yamamoto found a job.
Or: Thanks to being good at Chinese, it seems that Mr. Yamamoto found a job.
Or is both possible here?

くらい which is very similar to ほど:
木村さんは楽しみにしていた旅行に行けなくなって、かわいそうなぐらいがっかりしていた。
It's really difficult to translate ほど/くらい sentences for me, although I think I really understand the basic meaning, though.
Mr. Kimura can't go do the journey anymore he was looking forward to so much and he was so dissapointed that you only could pity him.

その歌を歌うたび、幼い日のことを思い出す。
I read somewhere that "ni" cannot be omitted in "tabi ni", but why is there no "ni" in this sentence then?

その企画は計画どおりには進まなかった。
What exactly(!) is the difference between 企画 and 計画?

After finishing another chapter of grammar points and doing the test at the end, I feel more comfortable now. Thanks to really paying attention and asking here I was able to get a good grasp of the grammar points and only made 3 mistakes in the end. That's way better than last time.
Again, thanks so much! (〃⌒ー⌒)/～❤

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-19

chochajin Wrote:今くらいの日本語ではビジネスの世界では通用しない。

KiC sentence again.
I can't use my current Japanese in the business world????
通用しない means "not effective," "doesn't work" or something along those lines. So, if the example sentence is talking about the speaker's Japanese, the 通用しない part means "my Japanese doesn't cut it."
chochajin Wrote:時間と労力をかけた割には、成果がなかった。

While I think I can grasp the basic idea of this sentence, I'm not sure how to translate it.
The result stands in no relation to the time and effort we put into it. (more lit. would probably be something like Compared to the time and effort we put into it, there wasn't a corresponging result.)
I think you got the meaning right. It just means someone put time and effort, only to get little results, i.e., it didn't pay off/worth it.

I don't think translating a sentence without context is possible. If anything, I think there is no such thing as an "equivalent" regardless of whether it's a letter, word, phrase, sentence or even a whole book in a strict sense. One of the translation techniques I know is to forget anything and everything other than context and ask yourself what you or a hypothetical speaker would say in the target language in the same kind of situation. It seems this works very well for general, non-technical translation as long as you have a good command of the target language. I don't know if more sophisticated translation techniques are necessary to learn a language. If you're interested in translation, I guess it's better to focus on learning the source language, which is Japanese in your case, before working on advanced skills that have little to do with language learning. I think translation is too advanced.
chochajin Wrote:この問題は重要な問題なのできちんとした話し合いの場を設けましょう。

I do understand this sentence, but I've been wanting to ask about this for a while now.
The construction "adv.+した" - how and when is it used?
Could you just use きちんと without the した in this sentence as well? Does it have a special nuance?
きちんとした is modifying 話し合い while きちんと would modify the verb 設ける if you drop した. In other words, きちんと in きちんとした is modifying した, which is a conjugated version of する.
chochajin Wrote:チームで仕事をしていると、連絡をよくしておかないと、仕事が重複してしまう。

The use of "しておく" here emphasizes that it should be done in advance?
連絡をよくしておく here is like "make sure to keep in close touch." This kind of Xおく(X is a verb) is "make sure that I will be in a situation where I have done X so things go well." rather than "I do X in advance."
chochajin Wrote:駅を中心にたくさんの商店が集まっている。

中心に So the station is being made into the center, right?
A lot of shops are concentrated here with the station being the center.
OK?
Hmm... I think it's ok. The core meaning is that there are many shops around the station.
chochajin Wrote:うちに cannot be used when the noun is an event, e.g.
授業のうちに、会議のうちに is not possible, but there's this one example sentence in one of my books:
休みのうちによく寝ておきます。 (I slept a lot during my vacation.)
So vacation doesn't count as event, because it's not just a short period of time, but a few days or even weeks?
The notion of 休み in question is kind of like "off" as in "I took a day off" and "He's off today" or "closed" as in "Closed on Sundays." Does this make it less event-ish? If not, you might want to ask the person what s/he meant by "event." Or maybe you can forget about it and learn collocations through exposure so you develop an instinct for this kind of thing.
chochajin Wrote:山本さんは中国語が上手なおかげで、いい仕事が見つかったそうです。

Does "そうです" refer here to the whole sentence?
Is it: It seems that thanks to his good Chinese ability, Mr. Yamamoto found a job.
Or: Thanks to being good at Chinese, it seems that Mr. Yamamoto found a job.
Or is both possible here?
First off, そうだ isn't "it seems." Here is my post about そうだ/みたいだ/ようだ:

http://forum.koohii.com/showthread.php?pid=78326#pid78326

The そうだ in question is the "hearsay" usage, and you can find a link to a thread about it. There are another link to complementary explanations in the post too.

As for the meaning of the sentence, does the second translation mean, "The reason I have the opinion that いい仕事が見つかったそう is that 山本さんは中国語が上手なおかげ"? If so, the original Japanese sentence can't be interpreted that way.
chochajin Wrote:くらい which is very similar to ほど:
木村さんは楽しみにしていた旅行に行けなくなって、かわいそうなぐらいがっかりしていた。
It's really difficult to translate ほど/くらい sentences for me, although I think I really understand the basic meaning, though.
Mr. Kimura can't go do the journey anymore he was looking forward to so much and he was so dissapointed that you only could pity him.
I suck at translation too, so I can't answer this question... The translation technique I mentioned somewhere in this post doesn't work well when there is virtually no context, and hence it's almost useless here too... I think professional translators have a whole different set of skills.
chochajin Wrote:その歌を歌うたび、幼い日のことを思い出す。
I read somewhere that "ni" cannot be omitted in "tabi ni", but why is there no "ni" in this sentence then?
その歌を歌うたびに sounds better in a grammatical sense and much more popular, I think. The に-less version also makes sense, so it's not that big of a problem. It may be considered wrong depending on the definition of "wrong." It might be better to always use に in this kind of sentence.
chochajin Wrote:その企画は計画どおりには進まなかった。
What exactly(!) is the difference between 企画 and 計画?
They are very frequent words, and some fields use them as technical terms. So the difference also depends on context. In general, 企画 is about a larger picture such as setting a goal etc. while 計画 is more about an actual process to meet the goal. Also, 企画 is usually larger than the average 計画. A small plan isn't 企画. If you plan a family trip for the coming Sunday, it's probably 計画. You give a presentation about your 企画 in a business meeting, and if your boss approves it, you make a detailed plan, which is 計画.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - iSoron - 2010-02-19

草原の国と呼ばれるに相応しい光景で、その自い風景は見渡す限りまっすぐに続いている。

Is this sentence any different from the following?

草原の国と呼ばれるのに相応しい光景で、その自い風景は見渡す限りまっすぐに続いている。

Are both grammatically acceptable?

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-19

iSoron Wrote:草原の国と呼ばれるに相応しい光景で、その自い風景は見渡す限りまっすぐに続いている。

Is this sentence any different from the following?

草原の国と呼ばれるのに相応しい光景で、その自い風景は見渡す限りまっすぐに続いている。

Are both grammatically acceptable?
Both are ok. Careful speakers would make a distinction between verb+に相応しい and verb+のに相応しい, and it's not a stretch to say that one form is preferred over the other depending on context, rhythm and so on. But there is little, if any, difference in meaning. I suppose you could say they're pretty much interchangeable. Expressions such as 〜に値する (にあたいする) also behave the same way. There are phrases that usually don't follow の, e.g., 〜に違いない (にちがいない) as in 彼も行くに違いない. In any case, regional differences and personal preferences might be a larger factor than grammar.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Asriel - 2010-02-20

Just a simple, quick little question...

What's the difference between:
惹き付ける
引き付ける

It seems that 引き付ける is much more common, and general-use, whereas 惹き付ける uses a kanji which is more rare, and seems to have more of a "sex appeal" connotation to it?

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-20

@magamo様: Thanks again, that really helped a lot!


約束したのだから、行くしかないだろう。
Would したから work as well? I thought の+(だ)から is not possible, because both mark a "reason" so in this case it's like a double use or something?

守れないような公約なら、最初からしないほうがいい。
How can ような be translated here?
I would understand something like 風邪をひかないような方法, but I can't really think of a way to translate the above example. "A promise so that you won't protect it"?

都市の環境は悪くなる一方なのに、若者は都会にあこがれる。
This sentence makes only sense to me if 都市 meant something like a very small town or the countryside. Does it?

早く手術しないと、手遅れになる恐れがある。
If I won't get a surgery soon, it will be too late, I'm afraid / it could be too late.
(unsure about the　遅れになる)

今度の日曜日には、友達と会うことになっています。
The grammar point ～ことになっている is explained like this:
The decision took place at some point in the past and the result of that decision is still in effect, sometimes to the extent that it has become a rule or a custom.
Alright, I understand it when you want to say, for example, that it has been decided that you teach English from now on and you're still teaching - but why is that form used in the example sentence above? Because he decided to meet his friend, but hasn't met him yet, but still intends to meet him, so his decision is still in effect? ('_')>

彼は何も言うまいと思っているらしい。
He definitely won't say anything at all(???)

日本へ行こうか行くまいか迷った。
After reading this example sentence I was wondering if ～まい can be used as "shouldn't" as in: I (guess I) shouldn't eat this.　食べるまいか。(<- or is it more s.th. like "I suppose, he won't eat it?")

彼はもう英語は教えまい。
He probably won't teach English anymore.
Can this sentence also mean: He definitely won't teach English anymore?

道が込みさえしなければ、駅までタクシーで10分ぐらいだ。
The ～さえ～ば construction is giving me headaches, but I think I got more or less a hang of it:
If the streets weren't that crowded, it would only take 10 min. by taxi to the station.

But how to translate this?↴
インスタントラーメンはお湯を入れさえすれば食べられる便利な食品だ。
インスタントラーメンは便利な食品だ。So instant ramen is convenient food, but only under the condition that お湯を入れさえすれば (you pour hot water on it). ???

言葉さえ共通なら、お互いにもっとコミュニケーションがよくできたでしょう。
As long as you have a common language, you probably can have a well-balanced communication with each other.
<- OK?


Thanks a lot in advance m( __ __ )m

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2010-02-20

Big pile here, so I'll just do a few.
chochajin Wrote:守れないような公約なら、最初からしないほうがいい。
How can ような be translated here?
I would understand something like 風邪をひかないような方法, but I can't really think of a way to translate the above example. "A promise so that you won't protect it"?
This is the 可能形 of 守る, so "promises you can't keep". ような is the 'kind of, sort of' meaning.
Quote:都市の環境は悪くなる一方なのに、若者は都会にあこがれる。
This sentence makes only sense to me if 都市 meant something like a very small town or the countryside. Does it?
No. There's a contrast being set up between "the urban environment is getting worse" and on the other hand "young people are drawn to cities".
Quote:早く手術しないと、手遅れになる恐れがある。
If I won't get a surgery soon, it will be too late, I'm afraid / it could be too late.
(unsure about the　遅れになる)
手遅れ is all one word. 手術する is the doctor speaking, not the patient. (the formality of
恐れがある is also a hint there).
Quote:インスタントラーメンはお湯を入れさえすれば食べられる便利な食品だ。
インスタントラーメンは便利な食品だ。So instant ramen is convenient food, but only under the condition that お湯を入れさえすれば (you pour hot water on it). ???
You've misparsed this. お湯を入れさえすれば links directly to 食べられる : it can be eaten if you just pour hot water on it. Then that clause modifies 便利な食品: it's a convenience food which you can eat if you just ...

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Hinode - 2010-02-20

I have a question about following sentence from the KO group effort lists:

湖の水面に小さく波が立っているな。
Is translated as "There are a lot of small waves on the surface of the lake."
Where does the "a lot of" come from? (Or is that just assumed from the context? Because small waves don't normally appear alone?)

This may be a foolish question, but why is 小さく　used? Isn't that the adverb form?

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Tobberoth - 2010-02-20

Hinode Wrote:I have a question about following sentence from the KO group effort lists:

湖の水面に小さく波が立っているな。
Is translated as "There are a lot of small waves on the surface of the lake."
Where does the "a lot of" come from? (Or is that just assumed from the context? Because small waves don't normally appear alone?)

This may be a foolish question, but why is 小さく　used? Isn't that the adverb form?
My take on it is that yes, "a lot" is simply taken from context and wouldn't be in a translation with high fidelity. 小さく is indeed adverbial form and therefore, I think it's an adverb in this sentence, modifying the whole phrase 波が立っている.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Spines11 - 2010-02-20

I'm confused about the end of this sentence:
だって「赤ちゃん言葉」って言う単語わからなかったんですもん ^_^

What is the purpose of the もん after です?

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Tobberoth - 2010-02-20

Spines11 Wrote:I'm confused about the end of this sentence:
だって「赤ちゃん言葉」って言う単語わからなかったんですもん ^_^

What is the purpose of the もん after です?
JLPT2 grammar, it's used when the speaker presents some situation as if it were a tangible object. What this means in practice is that it includes more emotion into a statement, such as exclamation, desire or conviction etc.

Oh yeah, it's short for ものだ, very colloquial.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Spines11 - 2010-02-20

Thanks Tobberoth!

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-20

Thanks a lot so far!
I hope somebody else can help me with the other problems as well ^-^

Meanwhile another question:
疲れで思考力が低下しているようだ。こんな時は思い切りスポーツをしたい。
How would you translate 思い切り here? "as much as I want"?

相手の人を尊敬している時だけ敬語を使うのではありません。相手に人があまり知らない人だったり、目上に人だったりする時にも、敬意を表すために敬語を使うのです。
I'm confused by the use of "ni" here.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Blank - 2010-02-20

chochajin Wrote:相手の人を尊敬している時だけ敬語を使うのではありません。相手に人があまり知らない人だったり、目上に人だったりする時にも、敬意を表すために敬語を使うのです。
I'm confused by the use of "ni" here.
Typo/misread again--those にs should both be の (just checked KIC).

For the ～まい stuff, check page 161 of Dictionary of Intermediate Japanese Grammar. If you don't own this book I'd highly recommend it, it's incredibly useful. In the meantime you can check this page which is the text of DIJG directly copied (who knows how they get away with that).

EDIT: I'm not sure if you're doing this, but just in case: I wouldn't recommend directly using the KIC spreadsheet without confirming the sentences in the book, even though it adds some more time. There are several mistakes in the transcriptions that can throw you off, as you've found. Sometimes I corrected them when I found them, but sometimes I forgot, so I suspect there are some still lurking...

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-20

@Blank: Thanks a lot! Smile

I do have the book and I checked the grammar point there, but still was a little bit confused afterwards Sad

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-20

Asriel Wrote:What's the difference between:
惹き付ける
引き付ける

It seems that 引き付ける is much more common, and general-use, whereas 惹き付ける uses a kanji which is more rare, and seems to have more of a "sex appeal" connotation to it?
Sort of yes. 引き付ける covers every sense of ひきつける, and 惹き付ける is often used to mean "charm," "mesmerize," "attract" etc. in an emotional sense. Sex appeal is a good example for the 惹 version. A charismatic leader can also 惹き付ける a lot of people. You might be able to 引き付ける people temporarily with a loud voice when you make an important point. But you need more sophisticated skills to completely 惹き付ける your audience.
Hinode Wrote:湖の水面に小さく波が立っているな。
Is translated as "There are a lot of small waves on the surface of the lake."
Where does the "a lot of" come from? (Or is that just assumed from the context? Because small waves don't normally appear alone?)

This may be a foolish question, but why is 小さく　used? Isn't that the adverb form?
The sentence means "I can see ripples on the lake." I don't know what the translator was thinking.

As for 小さく, it's modifying 立っている (or, as Tobberoth said, 波が立っている as a whole). Using an adjective like 小さい wouldn't change the meaning very much in this case, but it's just a coincidence. Also, さざ波 might be better than 小さい波 etc. But then again, the original sentence uses 湖の水面 instead of 湖面, so I guess it doesn't matter.

chochajin Wrote:約束したのだから、行くしかないだろう。
Would したから work as well? I thought の+(だ)から is not possible, because both mark a "reason" so in this case it's like a double use or something?
There is a slight difference between 約束したのだから、行くしかない and 約束したから、行くしかない. Both are referring the fact that someone promised to go. But the former is seeing the fact sort of objectively while the latter sounds like there is less distance between the speaker and the promise in his/her mind. For example, the 約束したから version can mean that the speaker could get upset if they don't keep the promise or that s/he is the one who made the promise. It might imply the speaker didn't make the promise but should go together with the listener. It doesn't mean the 約束したのだから version can't carry these implications, but if the sentence is taken out of context, the majority of native speakers would take it that way.

Also, だろう indicates that there is a psychological distance between the fact that 行くしかない and the speaker, i.e., s/he is observing the situation as (kind of) an outsider. So 約束したのだから fits better. Of course, the speaker might be the one who made the promise and should go. But if that's the case, it sounds like s/he is very reluctant. Maybe he said he would go when he was drunk but doesn't want to now. In this case, the sentence is most likely a monologue or the promise isn't between the speaker and the listener. It could be rude if you say it right in front of the person you made the promise to.
chochajin Wrote:今度の日曜日には、友達と会うことになっています。
The grammar point ～ことになっている is explained like this:
The decision took place at some point in the past and the result of that decision is still in effect, sometimes to the extent that it has become a rule or a custom.
Alright, I understand it when you want to say, for example, that it has been decided that you teach English from now on and you're still teaching - but why is that form used in the example sentence above? Because he decided to meet his friend, but hasn't met him yet, but still intends to meet him, so his decision is still in effect? ('_')>
なっています indicates that it's kind of a plan and the subject has little control over the situation at this point in time. In this sense, it's sort of similar to "be going to," but it doesn't imply a strong intention. It just means that the future situation will be like that and that it's sort of a plan.
chochajin Wrote:彼は何も言うまいと思っているらしい。
He definitely won't say anything at all(???)
(The omitted subject is)
思っている thinking
彼は何も言うまいと that he won't say anything
らしい this is what I heard.

It could mean "I heard he was dead set and wouldn't tell us/them anything about it" or something, but it's kind of strange to interpret the sentence that way. It's more like "From what I heard, I guess X still believes he will keep silent," where X is the trivial subject that doesn't appear in the original Japanese sentence and is different from "he."
chochajin Wrote:日本へ行こうか行くまいか迷った。
After reading this example sentence I was wondering if ～まい can be used as "shouldn't" as in: I (guess I) shouldn't eat this.　食べるまいか。(<- or is it more s.th. like "I suppose, he won't eat it?")
Translation always requires context. It may or may not be translated as "shouldn't." Anyone who says they can translate "食べるまいか。" without context clues is a liar or an alien who can do the impossible.

I think the example sentence is meant to teach 食べまいか (食べるまいか is much less common) as in

(Looking at a cute cross-dresser sleeping in your bed)
食べようか食べまいか、それが問題だ。
To ***** or not to ***** – that is the question.

よう and まい are indicating the speaker's will. He's in a "Do I?! Do I?!" situation.
chochajin Wrote:彼はもう英語は教えまい。
He probably won't teach English anymore.
Can this sentence also mean: He definitely won't teach English anymore?
Sort of yes. But 彼は絶対これからも英語を教え続けるよ！can also mean "He will never ever teach English again" depending on your tone of voice. Sarcasm ftw.

On a more serious note, if you pronounce 彼はもう英語は教えまい。with flat intonation like a robot, I think "definitely" is a little too strong for its translation.
chochajin Wrote:言葉さえ共通なら、お互いにもっとコミュニケーションがよくできたでしょう。
As long as you have a common language, you probably can have a well-balanced communication with each other.
<- OK?
If you mean something along the line of "If only there weren't language barrier, we would be able to communicate much better," I think it's all right. But it's impossible to give accurate translation without context. It might mean something like "They were from different countries and spoke different langauges, so they couldn't communicate efficiently." It might be talking about difficulty of communication between two different fields because of jargon.
chochajin Wrote:疲れで思考力が低下しているようだ。こんな時は思い切りスポーツをしたい。
How would you translate 思い切り here? "as much as I want"?
If the situation is like the deadline is approaching and the speaker is too tired to think clearly because he's been working very hard, I'd translate the second half as:

Makes me wanna play some sport and forget about work completely.

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - chochajin - 2010-02-21

@magamo: Thanks again m( __ __ )m

親の意向を聞くわけではないが、一応ガールフレンドを両親に会わせた。
I shouldn't ask about my parents' opinion, but ...
<- is that alright?

これは考えぬいて、出した結論です。
I couldn't find anything anywhere about the grammar point "～ぬく".
Of course it says that it means "最後までがんばって〜する　•　非常に〜する", but with just that it's still difficult to understand the meaning 100%.
So, what does the sentence above mean? This is the conclusion I came to after thinking a lot about it (giving my best to think about it)??

Sorry, I also have to ask about the ～さえ～あればetc. construction one more time, because I still am not sure what it's supposed to express.
Something that COULD be true if only the conditions were fulfilled?
体さえ丈夫なら、どんな苦労にも耐えられると思う。
If only your body would be healthy, then I think you could bear any hardship.
or is it more something like:
As long as your body is healthy/fit, you can bear any hardship??
- it's really confusing me to no end *sigh*

The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - magamo - 2010-02-21

chochajin Wrote:親の意向を聞くわけではないが、一応ガールフレンドを両親に会わせた。
I shouldn't ask about my parents' opinion, but ...
<- is that alright?
I think "It's not that..." is a more versatile translation of 〜わけではない, e.g., It's not that I wanted to know my parents' opinion. But I thought it might be better to let them know and introduced her to them. "It's not like..." and "It's not as if..." are also oft-used translations of 〜わけではない. If the context is that the speaker said it because he doesn't think it's a good thing to ask their opinion, then "shouldn't" is good.
chochajin Wrote:これは考えぬいて、出した結論です。
I couldn't find anything anywhere about the grammar point "～ぬく".
Of course it says that it means "最後までがんばって〜する　•　非常に〜する", but with just that it's still difficult to understand the meaning 100%.
So, what does the sentence above mean? This is the conclusion I came to after thinking a lot about it (giving my best to think about it)??
This ぬく is similar to "through" as in "think through," "go through," "get through," "read through," etc. You might want to treat 考え抜く as one word or an idiom whose meaning is sort of predictable because there are many similar expressions such as 生き抜く and やり抜く.
chochajin Wrote:Sorry, I also have to ask about the ～さえ～あればetc. construction one more time, because I still am not sure what it's supposed to express.
Something that COULD be true if only the conditions were fulfilled?
体さえ丈夫なら、どんな苦労にも耐えられると思う。
If only your body would be healthy, then I think you could bear any hardship.
or is it more something like:
As long as your body is healthy/fit, you can bear any hardship??
- it's really confusing me to no end *sigh*
It means "This is the only thing that prevents it," "This is the bottleneck," "If you just do this," "This is the only thing we need to be true to make another statement true," "If only this were..., it would be...," "I wish this were... so it could...," and..., er, there are too many possibilities...

Anyway, here are simpler examples:

体さえ丈夫なら、それを耐えられる。You can take it if you have a strong body. (And this is the only requirement, so, for example, you don't need mighty willpower.)
体さえ丈夫なら、それを耐えられた。If you had had a strong body, it wouldn't have been a problem. (But you couldn't take it. And I think lack of physical toughness is the reason you failed.)

I guess the tense of the second example is kind of twisted, but it means pretty much the same as 体さえ丈夫だったなら、それを耐えられた. The difference is that this "past + past" version can sound like it was an exceptional case that the person wasn't in good condition. For example, this version is better if the guy used to be an athlete but couldn't do it because his body was already weak because of a serious disease. If you're making fun of a weakling, the second example is better.

Does this make sense?