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The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Splatted - 2012-06-25
「まわりの風景に気持を向ける余裕なんてどこにもなかったのだ。」
I didn't have the luxury (or time to/whatever) of paying attention to my surroundings.
I think you've misunderstood what に is doing here. It's not marking location, but rather the direction/target of 向ける. It's probably clearer if you take 気持ちを out of the sentence: 「まわりの風景に向ける余裕なんてどこにもなかったのだ。」 Can you see how that means he didn't have the time (or whatever) to face his surroundings? 気持ちを is just clarifying that by explaining he's not talking about physically facing his surroundings.
TheVinster Wrote:「どうしてこんなことが起りうるんだろう、と。」I think so, but I must admit I used rikaichan for うる. Take it or leave it.
What word うる at the end of 起り have? He is asking why this could have happened?
「僕には直子の顔を今すぐ思いだすことさえできなのだ。」
Right now I can't even remember Naoko's face. (Sorry if I got the name wrong)
さえ is basically "even"
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Splatted - 2012-06-25
TheVinster Wrote:Thanks again both of you, I understand now. After 2 years of studying Japanese it really hits me hard to know my reading comprehension is so low. It's my own fault for not committing to reading books.It's hard at first, but don't get discouraged. You'll be surprised at how quickly you improve if you just keep at it, and from what I've read on the forum you have a larger vocab than me (and have probably studied more grammar), so all you need is practice.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - TheVinster - 2012-06-25
Thanks. It's possible I may know more vocab than you but it definitely shows that knowing more of something doesn't matter if you can't put it into practice. I'll keep at it.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2012-06-26
TheVinster Wrote:「どうしてこんなことが起りうるんだろう、と。」verb+うる/える: "can" : http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=uru
What word うる at the end of 起り have? He is asking why this could have happened?
You probably know ありえない and maybe ありうる already -- same grammar form.
Quote:Don't know さえ. I understand everything else.さえ : "even/only/just". http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=sae
I've given links to jgram here, but what I'd actually recommend is looking these up in a decent grammar reference like the D*JG or 日本語文型辞典. They're both JLPT2 level grammar points so it shouldn't be too hard to find a reference with a decent explanation.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - pm215 - 2012-06-26
Splatted Wrote:「僕には直子の顔を今すぐ思いだすことさえできなのだ。」Not quite: "I can't even bring Naoko's face to mind immediately", ie the 今すぐ attaches to 思いだす, not できない. (Rubin's translation here is "I can't even bring back Naoko's face -- not right away, at least.") In the next paragraph the narrator starts talking about how if he takes a minute or so her face gradually surfaces in his memory.
Right now I can't even remember Naoko's face.
[NB: I'm not going to claim I'd have noticed that if I hadn't looked at the English version :-)]
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Splatted - 2012-06-26
pm215 Wrote:Good point. Thanks for pointing that out.Splatted Wrote:「僕には直子の顔を今すぐ思いだすことさえできなのだ。」Not quite: "I can't even bring Naoko's face to mind immediately", ie the 今すぐ attaches to 思いだす, not できない.
Right now I can't even remember Naoko's face.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - TheVinster - 2012-06-26
「僕は何ごとによらず文章にして書いてみないことには物事をうまく理解できないというタイプの人間なのだ。」
Gonna keep reading tonight but I'll post this here for now. I can probably understand the second half. "I'm the type of person who can't understand things that well." The first half stumps me, though. And yes my translation is probably off due to context in the first half.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Ash_S - 2012-06-26
I don't know how to elegantly translate this but isn't it basically saying "I'm the type of person who can't understand things well without putting them into writing."
edit: I'm the type of person who (僕は...というタイプの人間なのだ) can't understand things well (何ごとによらず物事をうまく理解できない) without putting them into writing (文章にして書いてみないことには).
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - TheVinster - 2012-06-26
That sounds right. I don't understand the separate parts of the first half though. More specifically how are 何ごと and よらず interacting? What exactly does よらず mean? Is there a dictionary form I could put in Anki?
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Fillanzea - 2012-06-26
Ah, I had to go back to my copy to get the full context. Which is that -- even with all the time that's passed since the events he describes in the book, all this stuff is still kicking around in his head and he feels like he needs to write it all down to understand it and make peace with it. Because
"I'm the type of person who can't understand things that well unless I write them out."
によらず：
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/thsrs/17195/m0u/%E3%81%AB%E3%82%88%E3%82%89%E3%81%9A/
If it was something による, then the narrator would need to write some things down and not others. But 何事によらず negates that -- the topic doesn't matter, he just needs to write things down to understand them.
[Sorry, I edited this, I completely misunderstood it the first time.]
There's an explanation here of ことには
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/thsrs/17232/m0u/
But basically 書いてみないことには means "unless I try to write it."
The Jay Rubin translation is "I have to write things down to feel I fully comprehend them." Yeah, I think "Fully comprehend" captures the nuance of うまく理解 a little better.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - TheVinster - 2012-06-26
Hm, I think I got it now. Thanks guys.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - yudantaiteki - 2012-06-26
Fillanzea Wrote:There's an explanation here of ことにはAnd in addition to that explanation, the meaning is fairly clear from the parts as well -- "At least (は) with regards to/towards (に) situations/things (こと) I don't try writing (書いてみない)..." Of course a much smoother translation is "Unless I write it down."
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/thsrs/17232/m0u/
But basically 書いてみないことには means "unless I try to write it."
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - turvy - 2012-06-27
These sentences come from a (3rd grade) book, the story's title is どうして朝になったり夜になったりするの？
1. 太陽は一つの方向から地球をてらします。
2. そして、あなたが地球上のある場所にいるとして、地球が軸を中心に亥回転するとどうですか。
3. あなたのいる場所は、回転に会わせて光が当たったり、当たらなかったりすることが分かるでしょう。
1. What is から doing in there?
2. The multi-faceted として keeps making me trip, plus I don't understand the sentence overall.
3. I don't get the sentence.
Thanks
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - yudantaiteki - 2012-06-27
turvy Wrote:These sentences come from a (3rd grade) book, the story's title is どうして朝になったり夜になったりするの？1. It means "from".
1. 太陽は一つの方向から地球をてらします。
2. そして、あなたが地球上のある場所にいるとして、地球が軸を中心に亥回転するとどうですか。
3. あなたのいる場所は、回転に会わせて光が当たったり、当たらなかったりすることが分かるでしょう。
1. What is から doing in there?
2. The multi-faceted として keeps making me trip, plus I don't understand the sentence overall.
3. I don't get the sentence.
Thanks
2. 亥回転 is a typo but I'm sure exactly for what.
The sentences are basically saying that the sun illuminates Earth from one point, and when you stand on earth it rotates, so that's why sometimes the sun's light reaches you and sometimes it doesn't. If you have more specific grammar questions I can address those too.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - turvy - 2012-06-27
Well, let's see:
太陽は一つの方向から地球をてらします。
The sun shines on the earth from one direction. (Does that make sense? Shouldn't the correct statement be more like 'the sun shines on one side of the earth'.
そして、あなたが地球上のある場所にいるとして、地球が軸を中心に一回転するとどうですか。
I can't translate it literally. What is として here?.
あなたのいる場所は、回転に会わせて光が当たったり、当たらなかったりすることが分かるでしょう。
I am confused about 会わせて and can't translate it literally either.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - callmedodge - 2012-06-27
Just curious if this would be the correct way of phrasing this:
彼はギターを弾いているのについては、気乗りを示している。
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - yudantaiteki - 2012-06-27
turvy Wrote:Well, let's see:I don't know what's "correct" but the sentence says that the sun shines on the Earth from one direction.
太陽は一つの方向から地球をてらします。
The sun shines on the earth from one direction. (Does that make sense? Shouldn't the correct statement be more like 'the sun shines on one side of the earth'.
Quote:そして、あなたが地球上のある場所にいるとして、地球が軸を中心に一回転するとどうですか。It sets up a situation, basically. If you are in a certain place on the earth, then what happens if the Earth turns once on its axis?"
I can't translate it literally. What is として here?.
Quote:あなたのいる場所は、回転に会わせて光が当たったり、当たらなかったりすることが分かるでしょう。Shouldn't that be 合わせて? Along with the rotations, or matching the rotations?
I am confused about 会わせて and can't translate it literally either.
I'm not really sure why you're so bent on making literal translations. If you understand it, you don't need to literally translate it -- you don't need to translate it at all. Many Japanese grammar points resist literal translation.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - turvy - 2012-06-27
Now, I see you as one of my 'teachers' (I'm sure many people here do so as well) so I very often take your advice, but in this issue I'll stick with 'literal translations'. This is similar to the culture thing topic I started. If you give me a good translation what I actually end up doing is reading a well formed English sentence informing me what the Japanese means rather than what's actually said in Japanese.
I will try to translate them again (as an exercise and so that I can communicate to you my interpretation):
(2) そして、あなたが地球上のある場所にいるとして、地球が軸を中心に一回転するとどうですか。
Now, (suppose) you are in a certain place | (that is) on the earth, then what if the earth turns once in its axis.
I didn't know how to fit in 中心 and that ある in there after 地球の is what we are translating as a 'certain place' or a 'place that is' right?
I am still baffled by (3) so let me think a little bit more.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Fillanzea - 2012-06-27
ある here is like the ある in ある日, "one day." Grammatically it works like "a place that exists," but the meaning is just "one [arbitrarily chosen, abstract] place."
Literally, 軸を中心に一回転する would be "turns once with the axis at its center."
あなたのいる場所は、回転に合わせて光が当たったり、当たらなかったりすることが分かるでしょう。 (I have taken the liberty of correcting the kanji)
あなたのいる場所は - as for the place where you are
回転に合わせて - going along with the rotation
光が当たったり、当たらなかったりする - light would hit it or not hit it
ことが分かるでしょう - you can probably understand
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - turvy - 2012-06-27
Yeah, now I can probably understand lol. Thank you kind sir.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - kudokupo - 2012-06-27
「この荷の目方は70キロってとこかね。」
I don't understand 「とこ」in this sentence.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - SammyB - 2012-06-27
From Core6k:
これまでで最高の結果が出たよ。
I've come across this までで a few times... Why is the second で needed here? Would the sentence also be grammatically acceptable without it?
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - callmedodge - 2012-06-28
私はお酒を飲んでみる。
私はお酒を飲もうとする。
As far as I know, both of these sentences mean "I try to drink alcohol." but is there a certain nuance that is contained within each conjugation or is one just not correct to use at all. It`s just Tae Kim mentions both of these in his guide but doesn`t really distinguish between the two.
On further inspection it seems the first one is "to try" and the second is "to attempt". I guess these have slightly different nuances in English as well but are very hard to explain. Would it be like this?
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - kitakitsune - 2012-06-28
kudokupo Wrote:「この荷の目方は70キロってとこかね。」Typo? Should be こと right?
I don't understand 「とこ」in this sentence.
The "What's this word/phrase?" thread - Tzadeck - 2012-06-28
kitakitsune Wrote:My first thought was that ってとこ could be a slangy way of saying といったところだ, a grammar structure that emphasizes that an amount is pretty small (and that the amount is an upper limit). It weighs 'only 70 kilos (at most).' (Check your N1 grammar books folks--it'll be there!)kudokupo Wrote:「この荷の目方は70キロってとこかね。」Typo? Should be こと right?
I don't understand 「とこ」in this sentence.
But I've never actually seen it before written this way, and ところ has so many meanings and uses that it's hard to keep track of them all.
(Edit)
Yeah, I was right I think. Apparently you can also say というところ and it means basically the same thing as といったところ.
って is a common shortening for という/と/というのは, and とこ is a common shortening of ところ. So there you go.