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+--- Thread: Learning japanese "on the side" - is it possible? (/thread-2941.html)
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Learning japanese "on the side" - is it possible? - yukamina - 2009-04-26
I'm kind of on the fence when it comes to English subs. I can listen and read the subs at the same time, so I still learn new stuff while watching anime with subs. But I can focus and listen a lot better without subs.
Some shows I can understand almost everything without subs(ex. Card Captor Sakura, Natsume Yuujinchou, Princess Tutu), but other shows I need the subs or I won't be able to enjoy it(Cowboy Bebop, Eva). After all, I'm not just watching anime for learning purposes.
Learning japanese "on the side" - is it possible? - activeaero - 2009-04-26
Codexus Wrote:Now as I've said, you need to concentrate so that you stay attentive to both the spoken dialog and the subs. I don't find that especially difficult but your results may vary.You're defeating your own argument but I don't think you see it yet.
Sure it's possible, you're not going to stay concentrated all the time, but personally I find it easier to stay concentrated when there are subs. When I can't follow the dialog, I'm easily distracted and start thinking about other things instead of listening.
I watch mostly subs and I notice the new things I've just learned all the time, I also usually pick up a few new words and also when I read something that could be interesting in the translation I go back and listen to that part again.
I think a new language is a gradual process. Each step should come when one is ready to take it. At some point, the subs will go but I'm not there yet and trying to rush that wouldn't be beneficial.
You talk about it "picking up things you just learned" which is exactly the point. If you have learned vocabulary/grammar from other sources, such as sentence mining, then the subs aren't teaching you anything.
You also say you need to "concentrate on both". In my experience of watching with subs this simply means "wait until I hear something I know, then read the subs and feel good about being right". As others have already said your brain can not read something in one language while simultaneously processing it into the audio of another language.......that you don't know. If you are truly concentrating on reading the subs then your brain is thinking in English, not Japanese. Remember, this is all about getting our brains use thinking in a way it is not use to doing. Every time you provide it with a cheat sheet it doesn't have to do that.
When you say it is easier to concentrate with subs because it keeps you from getting distracted guess what? You ARE distracted. Thinking in English is thinking in English. If you're reading the English subs then you're distracted.
Learning japanese "on the side" - is it possible? - Codexus - 2009-04-26
activeaero Wrote:Thinking in English is thinking in English.You're right.
Learning japanese "on the side" - is it possible? - yukamina - 2009-04-26
activeaero Wrote:You also say you need to "concentrate on both". In my experience of watching with subs this simply means "wait until I hear something I know, then read the subs and feel good about being right". As others have already said your brain can not read something in one language while simultaneously processing it into the audio of another language.......that you don't know.It's not necessarily simultaneous. I usually skim the subs quickly, then I have time to listen.
Learning japanese "on the side" - is it possible? - Gingerninja - 2009-04-26
Nukemarine Wrote:Ultimately, I guess we should go no subtitles at all (even the Japanese ones).i wish i knew where to find japanese subbed shows.. i either get stuck with no subs at all meaning i can pick out the sentance starts and endings and the middles are a blur. or i end up with some fansub,
altho yes you can pick out odd words and little phrases with subs if you ignore them and just listen, but i doubt you could follow anything lengthy as background. (says me as i listen to アタシんちの男子 with nothing but the plot synopsis to follow)
the best thing about mainstream tv is after a while you know exactly whats coming anyway so after you know the premise of the story you can pretty much just ignore the subs cos no major twists are coming and you can figure out what they mean as they say it and reverse engineer it from there.
subs have good and bad points, good points as a beginner your not just being battered with white noise, bad points you do tune 99% of it out, but you can pick little things.. unfortuanatly that does lead to the anime fan problem of only hearing when people say "kawaiiiii" and "baka" *shudder*
i may have strayed off topic.. ahem.
