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+--- Thread: 1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? (/thread-2802.html)
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - activeaero - 2009-03-26
I just completed "Japanese Sentence Patterns for Effective Communication" which added another 550 sentences or so on top of the 400+ sentences I had already put in from Tae-Kim's guide.
So now I'm on to do both volumes of KO2001. I've got my books and the spreadsheet and am kind of stuck wondering what to do. I feel like I want to step away from having English in my cards but at the same time that scares me lol.
If I do go monolingual in terms of my cards do I need to shy away from english completely when I first "learn" the words/sentences? For instance, with each new compound can I look at the English meaning the first time I learn it and then stick it into my deck without English from then on or does that defeat the point?
I'd also like to note that I'm now doing 10+ hrs of listening every single day. My headphones stay glued to my head. If I go completely monolingual is the idea that I'll just end up "getting" the meaning of the compounds I'm learning from the tons of contextual input?
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - bodhisamaya - 2009-03-26
Do the iknow list users here put together for KO2001
http://smart.fm/lists/47378
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - activeaero - 2009-03-26
bodhisamaya Wrote:Do the iknow list users here put together for KO2001I can't access iknow at work which is where a majority of Japanese studying is accomplished via my EEE PC (I work for the government at night which means I have nothing to do 90% of the time).
http://smart.fm/lists/47378
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - stoked - 2009-03-26
bodhisamaya Wrote:Do the iknow list users here put together for KO2001How does this list compare to the book? Is it better? In what way? Or exactly the same? Does it still make sense to buy the book now that there are the smart.fm listings? Huh?
http://smart.fm/lists/47378
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - wccrawford - 2009-03-26
You really shouldn't use the 2001ko iKnow lists without buying the book because 2001ko put a LOT of work into making those lists. And they're really good lists for beginners, too.
As for how it's better... The book gives you the list of items, but no direction on how you should be studying it. iKnow (or Anki) gives you the direction.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - yukamina - 2009-03-26
I don't know how people go about switching to monolingual, but I figure if you understand the Japanese definition, use it. If not, English won't kill you.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - alyks - 2009-03-26
activeaero Wrote:So now I'm on to do both volumes of KO2001. I've got my books and the spreadsheet and am kind of stuck wondering what to do. I feel like I want to step away from having English in my cards but at the same time that scares me lol.I certainly hope you're not letting your fears get the better of you. Do it anyway and get used to it.
If I do go monolingual in terms of my cards do I need to shy away from english completely when I first "learn" the words/sentences? For instance, with each new compound can I look at the English meaning the first time I learn it and then stick it into my deck without English from then on or does that defeat the point?
The reason you're asking these questions is you don't know why you would go monolingual dictionary. Is it because everybody is telling you? Then find out what you think. If it's because you feel like you want to step away from English in your cards, like you said, then that right there is the answer to your questions.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - mentat_kgs - 2009-03-26
yukamina Wrote:English won't kill you.But it'll take its toil.
Monolingual is worth it. One should try it as soon as possible. Maybe sooner.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - yukamina - 2009-03-26
mentat_kgs Wrote:And what do you do when you don't understand? And worse, what if you think you understand, but you don't?yukamina Wrote:English won't kill you.But it'll take its toil.
Monolingual is worth it. One should try it as soon as possible. Maybe sooner.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - activeaero - 2009-03-26
Yeah my real question is exactly how do I approach doing it at work where I don't have internet access with Japanese language support?
For instance let's take 円高, which is of course えんだか。 Do I have to know that it means "high yen rate" before I put it into my SRS or will the meaning work itself out over time as long as I know the reading?
Would semi-cheating work? For instance what if I didn't put the whole sentence translation in and just the key compound meaning I want to know out of that sentence? Yes, for that one word I'd have an english crutch but the rest of the sentence I would have to know from previous exposure. The key word in that sentence would then be reinforced as it appears in later sentences.
I guess what I'm really asking is that without easy access to a J to J dictionary what's the best way to be as monolingual as possible?
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - Codexus - 2009-03-26
I think you shouldn't go monolingual at this time. If you have to ask yourselves all these questions, you're not quite there yet.
You should only do that when you feel that it's clearly going to help you learn faster, not because "all the cool kids are doing it".
And off course you need to know the meaning of everything you put in your SRS, what are you learning if you don't know that?
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - Tobberoth - 2009-03-26
You should only go monolingual when you feel you know a word without looking it up in English. It's nothing you should force, it's something you should try from time to time. Let's say you find a language with a word you don't know. Try looking it up in a japanese dictionary first. If you don't understand wth is going on, just check a J-E dictionary. Better English than nothing.
It's worth remembering though that the more often you use a japanese dictionary, the better you get at relying on them, it won't just come automatically.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - rich_f - 2009-03-26
No need to force it until you feel comfortable doing it. But if you play with it some, you'll get a better feel for the idea, and you'll get a better gauge for when to go whole-hog on it.
When you feel more comfortable, try looking up words *you already know* in a J->J dictionary, and learn from the definitions. Dictionaries have their own style, too. The more words you look up, the more used to it you get.
And start with a 小学校 level dictionary, like the チャレンジ小学国語辞典. (ISBN 978-4-8288-0457-6). I think this edition is out of print, but there's probably a newer edition out. It covers a lot of basic K-6 level vocab, plus some extra. Definitions plus example sentences, and it's not written over your head. (And if it is, look up stuff in a J->E dictionary for now until you can figure it out without it.)
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - activeaero - 2009-03-26
Tobberoth Wrote:You should only go monolingual when you feel you know a word without looking it up in English. It's nothing you should force, it's something you should try from time to time. Let's say you find a language with a word you don't know. Try looking it up in a japanese dictionary first. If you don't understand wth is going on, just check a J-E dictionary. Better English than nothing.Ok I think I get it now. Going monolingual seems like it will really come into use once I've established a good "base" vocabulary and can start making my way through some real Japanese texts.
It's worth remembering though that the more often you use a japanese dictionary, the better you get at relying on them, it won't just come automatically.
For instance if I'm reading a Manga it might be: "Hmmm I get the jist of this sentence except for this one compound but based on the overall context I bet it means XYZ". I'd then check a J to J dictionary to see if it can confirm my assumption. If it does I might then throw in a few extra sentence with that same compound.
Does that sound about right?
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - alyks - 2009-03-26
yukamina Wrote:Experience will tell you what's correct and what's not.mentat_kgs Wrote:And what do you do when you don't understand? And worse, what if you think you understand, but you don't?yukamina Wrote:English won't kill you.But it'll take its toil.
Monolingual is worth it. One should try it as soon as possible. Maybe sooner.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - mentat_kgs - 2009-03-26
Or skip it. You are not ready for it yet. Have patience, focus on other stuff. Soon it'll naturally come back to you.
Btw, I disagree with Tob. I think monolingual is something you have to force. Its a huge pain in the beginning, but it does its job.
1k grammar sentences done & moving to KO2001. Monolingual time? - kazelee - 2009-03-26
mentat_kgs Wrote:Or skip it. You are not ready for it yet. Have patience, focus on other stuff. Soon it'll naturally come back to you.Depends on the dictionary you're using. I was using Sanseido.net for a while. Then a lot of the definitions started to include the word and or kanji I was looking up. Weird no?
Btw, I disagree with Tob. I think monolingual is something you have to force. Its a huge pain in the beginning, but it does its job.
I switched to yahoo and the definitions are far more simple. The only time I use a JE dictionary now is when I want to learn a Japanese word I already know in English.
Monodicts do suck when you have a small vocabulary, though. So waiting is also an option. Just, when you finally do go for it.... go for it