kanji koohii FORUM
恐い/怖い? - Printable Version

+- kanji koohii FORUM (http://forum.koohii.com)
+-- Forum: Learning Japanese (http://forum.koohii.com/forum-4.html)
+--- Forum: The Japanese language (http://forum.koohii.com/forum-10.html)
+--- Thread: 恐い/怖い? (/thread-2698.html)

Pages: 1 2

恐い/怖い? - sethg - 2009-03-06

I know that I'll eventually learn this through context, but I'm really curious. I've just finished up lesson 22 and so I've just learned both 怖 and 恐. Apparently, either can be used for the word こわい/frightened/scared.

Can anyone kind of explain the difference? Are there certain connotations that come with each of them?

恐い/怖い? - Smackle - 2009-03-06

I believe they can be used interchangeably. The dictionary does not list any difference and Microsoft IME does not either. There might be a little difference, but it is not huge.

恐い/怖い? - Nuriko - 2009-03-06

I've always wondered the same. Just now when I looked up 恐い and my dictionary lumped it in with the definition for かしこい。
かしこ•い【賢い・畏い・恐い】
（賢い）頭の働きが鋭く、知能にすぐれている。利口だ。賢明だ。「—•くて聞き分けのいい子供」
２
（賢い）抜け目がない。要領がいい。「あまり—•いやり方とはいえない」「もっと—•く立ち回れよ」
３
恐れ多く、もったいない。
「おことばはまことに—•くて、なんとお答えいたしていいか、とみにことばもいでませぬ」〈賢治•北守将軍と三人兄弟の医者〉

This is different from the "frightened/scared," definition it seems. I had no idea かしこい could also be read as 恐い。It seems very strange to me...
It's Mac OS's built in dictionary so it may be different from the other ones, btw.

恐い/怖い? - Smackle - 2009-03-06

If you search the internet, native speakers do not really understand the difference between the two either.

http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail.php?queId=4001221

恐い/怖い? - sethg - 2009-03-06

Ah, great link Smackle! I understood a bit of that, but a good deal of it I had to Rikaichan. Can anyone kind of summarize it? It got fuzzy for me near the end. That's pretty fascinating. I guess I'll just go with whichever one I see more. Hrmm...

恐い/怖い? - liosama - 2009-03-06

I remember when i learnt those two chars i asked my teacher the same thing, She said the one with 怖 is the more commonly used one. But this was a long time ago, maybe i heard her wrong, she gets annoyed at me asking kanji questions as everyone in my class struggle with normal 4kyuu kanji.

But yeah i figured i'll just leave it until i start reading, but i would like to know too Smile

恐い/怖い? - LordGolem - 2009-03-06

恐い and 怖い are used interchangeably, but 怖い is more common. 恐 kanji is usually used in the word 恐ろしい.

恐い/怖い? - QuackingShoe - 2009-03-06

LordGolem Wrote:恐い and 怖い are used interchangeably, but 怖い is more common. 恐 kanji is usually used in the word 恐ろしい.
This has been the only impression I've picked up about the two as well.

sethg, the poster gives a quick description of the differences between the composition and intended meaning of the two characters, which are pretty fluffy and meaningless. He acknowledges this by saying that, this said, he still isn't really aware of how to use them, but that 怖い should probably be used when you have no particular intention. But, he also points out that 恐 also has meanings along the lines of おそれいる and かしこまる, so that when saying something like 「イチローは、こわい選手だ」, 恐い might be preferable.

恐い/怖い? - jtrejo - 2009-03-06

恐 is used in the word 恐竜, dinosaur. In latin, dinosaur means "Terrible lizard", so perhaps 恐 is scarier than 怖い Big Grin.

恐い/怖い? - kirigirisu - 2009-03-07

I think 怖い is generally used more than 恐い just by reading various things - both are good to know though.

恐い/怖い? - misha - 2009-03-07

I asked a native-speaker about this recently. While they do seem to be used interchangeably, 「恐れる」 seems to be similar to the verb "to fear" in English, while 「〜が怖い」 seems to be similar to "to be afraid of".

e.g.

狼が怖い　to be afraid of wolves
狼を恐れる　to fear wolves

My two cents.

恐い/怖い? - howtwosavealif3 - 2009-03-07

Yeah second one is more used. 　There's a whole bunch of words where there's like 2/3 kanjis used interchangealy.

恐い/怖い? - QuackingShoe - 2009-03-07

Usually they aren't interchangeable. For instance, 捜す and 探す have distinct meanings, and 斬る is quite a different matter from 切る. In this case, though, there just doesn't seem to be much of a practical difference.

恐い/怖い? - Raichu - 2009-03-07

QuackingShoe Wrote:捜す and 探す have distinct meanings
They do? What are they?

恐い/怖い? - Tobberoth - 2009-03-07

QuackingShoe Wrote:
LordGolem Wrote:恐い and 怖い are used interchangeably, but 怖い is more common. 恐 kanji is usually used in the word 恐ろしい.
This has been the only impression I've picked up about the two as well.
Same here. I don't know about other mediums, but in manga 怖い is very common, 恐い isn't. 恐ろしい however, is.

恐い/怖い? - Jarvik7 - 2009-03-07

In my encounters with it, it has been like scary (怖い) vs fearful/fearsome (恐い). The second kanji seems more literary, or more scary (emphasized due to the 'rare' usage of the kanji in this word) than 怖い.

恐い isn't even listed under its own headword in any of my J-E dictionaries. In my 国語 dictionaries it is listed with a △ indicating rare usage.

恐い/怖い? - Smackle - 2009-03-07

恐い is used often to describe the Queen in Final Fantasy IX.
探す is more like searching for something you want like 宝探し
捜す is more like searching for something that has evaded your sight like a criminal.
But 探す and 捜す can be used somewhat interchangeably, I believe.

恐い/怖い? - Tobberoth - 2009-03-07

Jarvik7 Wrote:In my encounters with it, it has been like scary (怖い) vs fearful/fearsome (恐い). The second kanji seems more literary, or more scary (emphasized due to the 'rare' usage of the kanji in this word) than 怖い.

恐い isn't even listed under its own headword in any of my J-E dictionaries. In my 国語 dictionaries it is listed with a △ indicating rare usage.
Wow, this post makes so much sense, especially for those of us who has had enough context with 怖い and 恐ろしい. I'm not saying it's true of course but if the context of those words, it's certainly gives this very impression.

恐い/怖い? - QuackingShoe - 2009-03-07

探す = something you want 捜す = something lost/missing. In windows IME, hovering over any given kanji selection for a few seconds will give you disambiguation text. So, like it says, you'd 借家を探す, but 迷子を捜す. This is also why, as Smackle stated, words like 宝探し or 探検 get the 探, and words like 捜査 get the 捜.
They might be used interchangeably sometimes, but it's still incorrect. I mean, depending on the specific words or specific situations, it may or may not be a big deal. Like, most people have no idea how to use 'effect' and 'affect' in English (myself included, most of the times). So maybe a 捜す/探す swap won't get the harshest of scrutiny from some people. On the other hand, saying 映画を診る...

恐い/怖い? - Jarvik7 - 2009-03-07

affect = verb
effect = noun (except when being used in the sense of "effecting a change")
Big Grin

I think what is much worse is how so many people don't know their vs there vs they're. Or that "I could care less" is wrong and makes absolutely no sense.

恐い/怖い? - QuackingShoe - 2009-03-07

And affect is also a noun dealing with (displayed) emotion, which is where we get 'affectation'. I actually do 'know' it all, but manage to forget whenever I need to actually use them, and end up having to refresh my knowledge periodically.
Only to forget again...

恐い/怖い? - Jarvik7 - 2009-03-07

QuackingShoe Wrote:And affect is also a noun dealing with (displayed) emotion, which is where we get 'affectation'. I actually do 'know' it all, but manage to forget whenever I need to actually use them, and end up having to refresh my knowledge periodically.
Only to forget again...
Scientific (psychology) language usage doesn't count, shifty scientists always bend language. Tongue Are you sure it's not just a nouned (to verb (to verb(to verb a noun) a noun)a noun) verb? You can use affect as a verb in that sense too though. affected emotion, affected accent, etc.

affectation is made from a verb (not noun) according to Oxford Tongue

恐い/怖い? - masaman - 2009-03-07

Although both are 「こわい」 when pronounced, the character 恐 looks more formal to me. 怖 represents more basic, down to earth, primitive fear while 恐 is often associated with more technical terms like 恐慌 (economic depression). It's just my gut feeling though.

恐い/怖い? - ikemasen - 2009-03-08

here's some Latin etymology
(noun) affectus: state, condition, emotion
(verb) afficere / affectum: i.a. evoke a mood.

恐い/怖い? - nac_est - 2009-03-08

Was there a thread with a list of all the groups of words with the same pronunciation but different nuances? Otherwise it would be nice to make one.