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+--- Forum: JLPT, Jobs & College in Japan (http://forum.koohii.com/forum-12.html)
+--- Thread: JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? (/thread-2188.html)
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - playadom - 2008-12-07
bodhisamaya Wrote:Ah, that is good to know. In the past I would mainly look at gaijinpot.com and the publications in the Kansai area aimed at gaijin.Cream puffs are light and fluffy -- generally lacking in toughness.
BTW...What is it to "Cream Puff" something? I have never heard that expression before.
I Googled it but nothing came up in verb form, slang or otherwise.
They could of course be saying that the JLPT was just so dang tasty by comparing it to a wonderful dessert =D
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - QuackingShoe - 2008-12-07
I assumed he meant nerfed, but I was just wondering the same thing aloud before you posted :o
Although nerfed usually refers to something a little different, I've never heard any slang used for this particular situation.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - wrightak - 2008-12-07
Tobberoth Wrote:JLPT2 and 1 definetly gets you jobs, even JLPT3 if we're talking about baito.I got a good job without JLPT 1. It's nice to have, but I think your speaking skills are far more important. If you can impress at the interview then I think that any JLPT deficiency will be overlooked.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - johnzep - 2008-12-07
I've always been under the impression that having the proper jlpt level is important for getting the interview and then you have to speak well in the interview. If the job specifies a JLPT level and you don't have it, your application is probably more likely to get tossed in the reject pile. Similar to GPA or LSAT or GRE scores for schools, it is a easy way to initially screen applicants
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Jarvik7 - 2008-12-07
Just finished JLPT2 (and the requisite drinking at the pub afterwards).
That was eeeeaaaasssssyyyyy, Pretty confident I've got an overall score >90%
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Tobberoth - 2008-12-07
bodhisamaya Wrote:Ah, that is good to know. In the past I would mainly look at gaijinpot.com and the publications in the Kansai area aimed at gaijin.I'm not native to English or something, but from the context (and the meaning of cream and puff) I take it it means "to make easy", in this case as a compensation for making the last one so hard.
BTW...What is it to "Cream Puff" something? I have never heard that expression before.
I Googled it but nothing came up in verb form, slang or otherwise.
Like you, I've never heard it before.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Tobberoth - 2008-12-07
johnzep Wrote:I've always been under the impression that having the proper jlpt level is important for getting the interview and then you have to speak well in the interview. If the job specifies a JLPT level and you don't have it, your application is probably more likely to get tossed in the reject pile. Similar to GPA or LSAT or GRE scores for schools, it is a easy way to initially screen applicantsExactly. JLPT does you no good if you can't shine during the interview, but if there's 200 applicants and only 1 spot, I'm pretty sure the people with JLPT1 qualifications will be the first ones to be invited to the interview.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - johnzep - 2008-12-07
So have the test and/or answers found there way to the internet yet?
Also on the 2級 reading, I ran out of time on the medium essays (I did grammar --> short --> long --> medium) and guessed lots of 2's on Part II. Anyone remember the right answers on that section being a lot of 2's ^_^
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Ji_suss - 2008-12-07
I figured out "to cream puff". But Quacking Shoe, what is "nerfed." I'm a native speaker, but i don't know. Does it refer to the soft football of my youth?
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - mbaron - 2008-12-07
Ji_suss Wrote:But Quacking Shoe, what is "nerfed."That's a term you hear in online role playing games alot. It means to reduce in effectiveness, usualy done by the game's admins to a power or item much beloved by a player. It is as if your Sword of Massive Doom were now covered in the material a Nerf Footballs are made from.
Back on topic, was the reading section on level 3 really as easy as I thought it was, or did I fall into a massive trap?
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - kfmfe04 - 2008-12-07
To "cream puff" or "Mickey Mouse" something is to make it easier or simpler than usual - it's obviously slang (all those previous posts explain it better)...
I think standardized tests are especially useful for people who self-study:
1. As points of focus for study (otherwise, I would never study grammar)
2. As feedback for progress - everyone seems to think they are great at reading comprehension, but how do you really know unless you use some kind of feedback, like a test?
3. Obviously, it's possible to get a job in Japan without JLPT (depends on the job), but like all things, having a JLPT2 is better than nothing, and having a JLPT1 is even better. However, these tests just open doors: generally, you have to do well in the interview itself.
-----------------------------
Even though it's true that just because you pass a test, it doesn't mean you are necessary proficient.
However, I think if you are really proficient, there should be no reason why you shouldn't be able to pass these tests (at least wrt what's tested - like reading, listening, etc...). The tests should be fun/easy for people who are proficient.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - bodhisamaya - 2008-12-07
mbaron Wrote:I've tested myself on the level 3 exams online from past years and they are really easy. The level 2 exams on the other hand are still out of my league.Ji_suss Wrote:."Back on topic, was the reading section on level 3 really as easy as I thought it was, or did I fall into a massive trap?
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - wrightak - 2008-12-07
johnzep Wrote:I've always been under the impression that having the proper jlpt level is important for getting the interview and then you have to speak well in the interview. If the job specifies a JLPT level and you don't have it, your application is probably more likely to get tossed in the reject pile. Similar to GPA or LSAT or GRE scores for schools, it is a easy way to initially screen applicantsI think it depends a lot on what kind of job you're going for. For jobs that get a large number of applicants, screening by JLPT level is easy. However, I suspect that the truth of the matter is that large companies that have to screen a large number of applicants aren't expecting foreigners. I remember having difficulties with online application forms that asked for information that only Japanese people can give. It also depends on what level you're at in your career, graduate jobs will get a flood of applicants but mid-level career jobs won't be like this.
I got my current job by going through a 人材紹介会社 so someone was liaising with the company on my behalf. For a foreigner looking for work in Japan, I think this is probably a good idea. I usually don't like dealing with these guys in my native country but here in Japan, they're much better equipped to scout out relevant jobs and negotiate for you.
I totally agree that having a JLPT qualification helps but it's not a requirement for a large number of jobs. My point is that currently, the JLPT doesn't test any productive skills at all. Hopefully that will change in the future but right now, I would concentrate on being able to speak fluently and appropriately before devoting all of my energies to the JLPT.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - kazelee - 2008-12-07
kfmfe04 Wrote:Don't just read the title - reread my posting, carefully.Common, dude. "I hear you have to be above native level to pass JLPT1." You're suppose to laugh, not throw out an insult. Sheesh.
No offense, but lucky you don't have to take an English reading comprehension test...
...oh, and I don't consider myself moderately effective at Japanese unless I can pass JLPT1. IMHO, if I did so, it it would put me on the lowest rung of fluency: enough to get by without major misunderstandings.
Suppose it's what I get for trying to play with words so late at night.
Quote:Nah. You have to be around fluent level to pass JLPT1, not native. No adult japanese person should be even close to failing JLPT1. I doubt they would consider it easy, but easily above 80%Of course there are always exceptions.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Diana - 2008-12-07
Let's all wait and see until we get our scores back.
Now, what I want to know is, when are the answers coming out!
I remember last year I came across a forum leaked from some chinese forum where they had the answers to the test. I wanna know what I got! Anyone know anything about this?!
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - wrightak - 2008-12-07
Tobberoth Wrote:Nah. You have to be around fluent level to pass JLPT1, not native. No adult japanese person should be even close to failing JLPT1. I doubt they would consider it easy, but easily above 80%.I think you'd be surprised at how fluent you don't have to be to pass JLPT1. I met this Korean guy whose spoken Japanese was very poor but had passed the exam.
The JLPT is mainly about reading. The listening comprises a small portion and if you're a kanji whiz, and you can read well, then you can pass without scoring very well on the listening. You don't write or speak anywhere.
It's similar to how Japanese people tend to be much better at reading English rather than speaking it.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - kfmfe04 - 2008-12-07
wrightak Wrote:I think you'd be surprised at how fluent you don't have to be to pass JLPT1. I met this Korean guy whose spoken Japanese was very poor but had passed the exam.Well, this is like what I mentioned before.
Passing JLPT1 doesn't necessary mean you're fluent, but if you are truly fluent (in the broader meaning of the word, including verbal fluency and literacy), you should be able to pass JLPT1 rather easily. I would expect a Japanese HS graduate to be able to get at least 80% without studying - probably closer to 90%+.
But input before output, right? If I can read and listen and understand Japanese, I have a better chance of producing something meaningful (at least after a ton of practice).
----------------------
The converse is a foreigner standing in front of me speaking seemingly fluent Japanese. If this guy can't even read a road sign or a menu, I wouldn't consider him fluent, either.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Jawful - 2008-12-07
The results are in! Using these pages, I figure myself at around a 68% on 2kyu. I can live with that.
1級 (answers)
・Kanji
・Vocab
・Listening (script)
・Reading (answers)
・Grammar
2級 (answers)
・Kanji
・Vocab (answers)
・Listening w/ pictures (script - no answers)
・Listening w/o pictures (script and answers)
・Reading
・Grammar
3級
・Kanji / Vocab (answers)
・Reading / Grammar (answers)
4級
・No data yet......
.
.
.
If you want to calculate your actual (probable) score, you can get the point values of each type of question from the back of a past test of whichever level you took.
In the case of 1級 (and 2級 is identical), the point values are as follows:
Kanji/Vocab (25% of grade)
Kanji questions = 1 point each
Vocab questions = 2 points each
Listening (25% of grade)
Picture questions = 1 point each
Non-pictures questions = 1 point each
Reading/Grammar (50% of grade)
Reading questions = 5 points each
Grammar questions = 2 points each
In the case of 3級 (and 4級 is identical), the point values are as follows:
Kanji/Vocab (25% total)
Kanji questions = 1 point each
Vocab questions = 2 points each
Listening (25% total)
Picture questions = 1 point each
Non-pictures questions = 1 point each
Reading/Grammar (50% total)
Grammar questions - 問題I, II, III = 2 points each
Grammar questions - 問題IV = 3 points each
Reading questions = 4 points each
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - woelpad - 2008-12-08
Jarvik7, I thought you had passed 1級 years ago. False impressions. Not too surprised though that you would have found it a walk in the park.
Trust the Chinese to shorten 3 months of nailbiting to a single day. I must have scored 80%, disregarding the omitted part. Guess I passed 2級. Swell.
My preparation was awful, though. In August, I quizzed myself on the 2007 tests, decided that 1級 would require some substantial studying, so applied for 2級 instead. Didn't do much at all in the next months, except for trying out the iKnow site. Last Thursday I visited the JLPT site again, did the 2級 for 2006, was appalled by the amount of noise in the audio for the listening section, but even more by the difficulty of the grammar questions. Friday and Saturday were spent entirely on wading through some grammar sites (recommend the Tanos site). Scan the expression, read the example sentence, judge if it makes sense, if not, take special note, go on. This will fast be forgotten, but it did boost my score on the grammar section (75%, judging by the answers on Jawful's site).
The audio on the day of the test was much better quality, thanks a lot. I had time to spare in every section, so that was a good sign. The picture questions were hard, but it looks like I didn't do too badly there. There are a few questions where I hesitated then and can't recall exactly what I chose, so take my score with a grain of salt.
Westerners were a minority (3 in my class room of 92), and the few I spoke were all taking 3級 or 2級, so the percentage in 1級 is probably even less. All the more reason to apply for that next time, though I'm not setting a date yet. I think when I'm beyond level 1, that's a good time to apply again. Unless it comes with a salary boost...
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - Jarvik7 - 2008-12-08
woelpad Wrote:Jarvik7, I thought you had passed 1級 years ago. False impressions. Not too surprised though that you would have found it a walk in the park.Really I should have been taking 1級 (everyone I know, which included the test proctor haha, was surprised that I was doing 2), but I need the certificate for work/visa purposes so I didn't want to leave any room for failure. I can just take 1級 in the summer or next Dec.
My study was also less than thorough (I'm finishing my 4th year of uni so I couldn't dedicate as much time as I wanted to). I never did any previous tests and never did any prep for reading or listening. I basically just imported a vocab list into Anki and went through that (although I never finished it).
My testing site had a lot of 4級 test takers who appeared to be of highschool age, they had to split them into two rooms. The 2級 room had a really good in-ceiling sound system so the audio was cake. Even if it was on a cd player it would have been no problem since I was in the front row (apparently I was the first person to sign up for the test). Most of the people were white, and according to my friend in 1級 it was the same there. Altogether only 22 people were taking 2, about half of which were friends/acquaintances. There were a fair number of Asians in line during sign-in so I can only assume they were mostly taking 3級.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - woelpad - 2008-12-08
I'm speculating that there was only one test site for the whole Chiba district (the slab of land between Tokyo Bay and the Pacific): 日本大学 (what's in a name) in Funabashi. 2級 occupied at least 2 floors of one building, 3級 another. 100 people per room, 4 rooms per floor. Some extrapolation would put this at 2000 people for all levels together, but I could be off. It was an immense line at the ticket gate of the train station on return, and whenever I changed train (4 times), I could spot people that had done the test. Quite funny. They were right to urge you to bring your own lunch bag, because I heard it was near impossible to get into the convenience store at noon for all the crowd. I would probably also have walked out and search for some fast food restaurant if I hadn't bought my lunch before arriving on the campus.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - uberstuber - 2008-12-08
I think I got around 65% on 二級, should've studied grammar more thoroughly but w/e.
I heard someone say there were about 300 test takers in seattle.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - captal - 2008-12-08
I took 3級 - my first attempt at the JLPT.
The kanji was really easy, but I didn't study any vocab lists so I'd say I only got 1/3 right, still I'd say around 70% for the section. Listening was almost too easy - the ones without pictures were very easy. I'd say I scored around 80-90%. Grammar... I'm not sure- I did all 50 questions and then went through them backwards and changed 10 answers... the lowest scored I got on any of the practice tests was 52%, so if I get at least that, and I think I did, I should have my pass.
Not that I really care- the lvl 3 isn't useful for much of anything- I only took it to make myself study, which really helped. I made it through the unicom book, which has really helped my grammar. I'm understanding a lot more in my listening and reading, so that's good.
I haven't decided if I want to put in the effort to try and take 2級 next year (or July, haha)- I mean it sounds doable, but I just don't have the work ethic. I think I'd rather do fun things like read books and watch movies and see where I'm at around summertime next year. My crazy friend wants to take 2級 in July, and he started studying Japanese in August. I'm not going to dissuade him but that's a steep hill to climb! To me, I think having to get 5000 vocab under your belt is a lot, because there are so many words that seem... less than useful to me.
Edit: wow... I'm pretty... stupid. I just realized that the questions are worth different points because of the info posted above. I'd just been counting up my correct answers/incorrect and figuring that as the percentage for the section. Lol. Ah well, I think I smashed both reading sections in grammar, so that's good. My kanji/vocab score isn't going to be very good though. Whoops.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - kfmfe04 - 2008-12-08
uberstuber Wrote:I think I got around 65% on 二級, should've studied grammar more thoroughly but w/e.That's pretty funny. I think there were at least 500 test takers in the building I was in... ...and there were 3 buildings (don't know how full the others were), but this is in a suburb directly outside of Central Tokyo.
I heard someone say there were about 300 test takers in seattle.
This was prolly one of the bigger test sites, but I hear there are 20 or so sites scattered around Tokyo.
JLPT 2008 Cream Puffed? - captal - 2008-12-08
According to the stats for last year, 103,000 people applied to take the JLPT in Japan and 93,000 took it, so I imagine Tokyo has quite a few sites.
The total number of people that took any level of the JLPT last year was over half a million!