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Eikaiwa Schools - byakko - 2008-11-28
I've been planning for some time now to pursue teaching at an Eikaiwa after graduation, and wanted to hear what some of you guys had to say, those of you who are already in Japan teaching at an English Conversation school. I've looked at the big ones, read their sites thoroughly; ECC, GEOS, AEON. If I am planning to graduate in the spring of 09, and would be willing and ready to go by say the end of June 09, when should I apply. Is sooner better than later? More importantly which school should I look to apply to? Is there one better than the other. I can see differences in teaching methods (vaguely), and in pay grades, locations, etc. based on their sites. But what should I be looking for or looking out for in choosing? If they're all about the same should I apply to all of them or be selective?
I'm not looking into this for a long term career, but would love the opportunity to spend a minimum of 1-2 years, perhaps more, experiencing and learning the Japanese culture while also giving me ample excuse and opportunity to practice Japanese. That being said I certainly don't view this as a 'paid vacation' and am eager to pursue it diligently and learn a great deal about teaching, which I anticipate and hope will be a rewarding experience.
Anyway, any input or info on this would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Eikaiwa Schools - Balaam - 2008-11-28
If you're eligible for the Jet program, I'd try that first.
Eikaiwa Schools - Ji_suss - 2008-11-28
I'd apply to all of them, to get over there, and then when you're there and working, you'll have a better idea of how things really work there, and can jump to a better/different place.
I'd also follow Balaam's advice and apply to the JET program, because a lot is done for you.
I don't think there's a whole lot of difference between the big chain schools. Don't be afraid to try a smaller place. If your goal is to practise Japanese, you'll get more of that in a small town, than in Tokyo.
Check out Dave's ESL Cafe online for information on specific schools and to discover the bad ones. http://www.eslcafe.com
And although it is advertised as not being necessary for many jobs, by all means take a TESL course before you go, if you can afford to. It will really pay dividends. On the other hand, it may just depress you because it will make you fully aware of just how poor the state of English education in Japan is!
As for timing, a lot of schools recruit year-round, but the "official" beginning of the school year is the beginning of April, so the best time to go is in mid to late March to get orientation training. If you're hired at other times of the year you may not get the full training--you may just be dropped into a class on your first day.
Disclaimer: I taught in Chiba from 1997 to 2000, so this info may be outdated.
Eikaiwa Schools - KristinHolly - 2008-11-28
Sooner is probably better. I think you've already missed the JET deadline. :-( The application process and paperwork may take longer than you expect, so you may want to at least make some initial contacts at all the companies. I imagine there could be more competition for English teaching jobs this year with so many companies in the States having layoffs . . . might as well apply to everything. I know at least one woman who taught at an Eikawa school for a year or two before doing JET. You may also want to apply for a Monbukagakusho scholarship, if your main purpose is to be in Japan.
Eikaiwa Schools - byakko - 2008-11-28
Thanks guys.
I was initially going to do the JET program, but it seemed like a long drawn out process with little chance of getting in (less than 20-25% as I recall) and quite honestly I'd rather have the chance to interact with adults in a more business oriented environment as I am planning to later return to the states to pursue an international MBA. So while I realize the JET program is more like a "paid vacation" where they definitely get more time to go do whatever and have a larger support group, I'd rather be at an eikaiwa. Having to work a lot, if that ends up being the case, is not an issue for me.
Unfortunately I won't be graduating until the end of May, so it seems i miss the beginning of the school year. But being dropped into something head first, day one kind of thing is fine by me, the challenge would be appealing.
Again, thanks for the info.
Edit:
http://www.tesolcourse.com/special-offers.php
"Certificate in Teaching Business English: CTBE - This 50 hr certificate course covers the major areas involved in the teaching of business English and is useful for any teacher wishing to specialize in teaching adults and business people. The normal cost of this course is $250 USD."
Is taking one of these TESOL courses a good thing to have on an application, and equally important would it be helpful to me? I'm not sure which TESL course you were referring to. Unfortunately I highly doubt I'll be able to go to any physical location to get a certification or what have you, as they all seem to be in large cities, but any online options, such as the ones in the link would be feasible. But was there something specific you had in mind?
Eikaiwa Schools - zoletype - 2008-11-29
I teach in an Eikawa now.
Don't expect to get much practice working at one, you aren't allowed to speak Japanese at most, if not all of them. Now if you just want to talk to adults about business then an Eikawa is good.
In terms of quality of life, Jet, or a dispatch company is probably best. The pay outstrips teaching at an Eikawa, where the hours are long and pay is not good (private lessons pay much better than an Eikawa does).
Good luck! I have a fair bit of knowledge about teaching in the Kansai area but totally lost when it comes to other places. If I can help, gimme a shout.
Eikaiwa Schools - chochajin - 2008-11-29
I'm working for an eikaiwa, too, and basically love it.
Well, but I also have to say that the eikaiwa is the reason why I DON'T have much time to study Japanese at all (some of you might remember my thread here about "how to secretly study at work" ;P). Anyway unlike some others here I'm allowed to use Japanese at work, it's not completely banned and at times I learn quite a few new words even from my youngest students.
Anyway, I'd also say try JET nevertheless. If you are from an English speaking country then the chances to get in are actually quite high. I couldn't do it as I'm German and there's usually only 0-2 positions per year for AGTs (Assistant German Teachers) and about 2341412312312 people that want to get in. So don't say chances are low for YOU *g*
JETs generally have the best working conditions out there, so I'd say it's definitely worth the application trouble and all *nods*
Also ... don't make the same mistake as me and try to look for schools that mention in their ad that they support you in your Japanese studies. There are schools like that. I've even once seen one that pays you part of a language school if you want to attend one before/after work.
In my school I'm not allowed to do ANYTHING that is not work-related, so even if there's nothing to do (which lately wasn't the case anyway) I can't study Japanese which ... sucks
Good luck
Eikaiwa Schools - byakko - 2008-11-29
The JET deadline just passed, so I'd have to wait another year if I wanted to pursue that, then another half a year to go through the application process. And quite honestly, despite whatever support and pay they may receive, the thought of exclusively teaching children in public schools does not appeal to me.
I hadn't counted on being able to practice Japanese at all whilst working, but going to school full time and working a job now leaves me little time for study anyway, so I'm used to having to squeeze time in when I'm not busy. I'm sure it'd be easy for an English speaker to stay in a English "bubble" and not have to be concerned with using Japanese, but that's certainly something I'd get away from, seeking out Japanese friends and going to places where I'd be forced to communicate in Japanese.
My main concern right now is just being able to get set up in Japan with a decent company and be able to save a little money every month, if being very frugal is the only way to save any money then so be it. I'm sure once I'm there I'll be bombarded with more options in work the following year, but how easy is it to get setup with something other than a decent sized eikaiwa that will provide living space and subsidized housing?
What is a dispatch company and is this feasible for someone who couldn't interview in Japan? As in, do I really need to be there in order to get into that work, or do they recruit in the USA? I've spoken to some Japanese people in Japan who mentioned private lessons, is this what you mean by a dispatch company? He did tell me the pay was much better but is it consistent? As in salaried? I'm certainly willing to do something like that if it is feasible for someone not yet set up in Japan.
Thanks again, I'm really looking forward to being able to do this, so all this information is certainly helpful.
Eikaiwa Schools - snallygaster - 2008-11-29
Of the 3 big Eikaiwas, ECC and Aeon have decent reputations from the worker's perspective. Geos doesn't. Of course, G-Com (the resurrected Nova) should not be under consideration, and for the time being at least neither should Berlitz.
I have never heard of dispatch companies offering better deals for the worker than eikaiwas; please give more details about this, Zoletype. In general, dispatch companies are the absolute bottom of the barrel. No, the pay isn't salaried; usually you're paid per-lesson (at a rate similar to, or less than, eikaiwa pay) so how much you make is dependent on how many lessons the company can get for you, and since you're a part-time contract employee, there's no guaranteed minimum income, job security, paid holidays / sick days or benefits. They don't normally hire outside of Japan anyway (since they aren't going to sponsor a work visa) so it doesn't really matter anyway.
Private lessons (ie outside the company, on your own time) are more profitable per hour, and a good way to make some extra money.
TESL training won't really make any difference in getting you hired. It will help you on the job, though.
If you're graduating in May, I'm not sure there's any point in applying before February or so. If you get hired, I believe they need your actual physical diploma to apply for the visa, which takes a couple of months.
Eikaiwa Schools - byakko - 2008-12-01
I see that Aeon offers private subsidized rooms whereas ECC offers shared living quarters and no mention of housing costs being subsidized. I'm assuming it'd be pretty difficult to setup living arrangements without the referral of a business or native, but does anyone have any input on this in particular ?
You mentioned that TESL training wasn't really helpful for getting the job but good knowledge to have, are there any courses you could recommend, schools or establishments that you are familiar with or the like. Is an online course a viable learning experience, such as the one i mentioned earlier?
Is there anything else I can do between now and when I apply that will look good on a resume and help me in getting a job? Or is most of their decision making done via the interview process ?
Again, Thanks for all the valuable input.
Eikaiwa Schools - shneen - 2008-12-01
byakko Wrote:I see that Aeon offers private subsidized rooms whereas ECC offers shared living quarters and no mention of housing costs being subsidized. I'm assuming it'd be pretty difficult to setup living arrangements without the referral of a business or native, but does anyone have any input on this in particular ?My company arranged my apartment.... so I haven't personally done any hunting. But yes, it can be difficult to arrange for housing on your own... a lot of places won't rent to a foreigner without having a guarantor of some sort. Not to mention it's pretty expensive (I had to pay around 180,000 yen upfront when I moved into my place).
I'm a "dispatch ALT," but that doesn't use dispatch in the sense that snallygaster mentioned. My job is the same as a JET ALT, but I'm contracted by a third party rather than by the local school board. It has it's advantages (awesome vacation time) and disadvantages.
I haven't been through the eikaiwa interview process, so I'm not sure what it all entails. I was offered an interview with GEOS but it was a crazy 3-day process and I would've had to fly to California (and pay for lodging) to do it, so I turned them down. But feel free to email me if you have any questions.
Eikaiwa Schools - Jarvik7 - 2008-12-01
byakko Wrote:I see that Aeon offers private subsidized rooms whereas ECC offers shared living quarters and no mention of housing costs being subsidized. I'm assuming it'd be pretty difficult to setup living arrangements without the referral of a business or native, but does anyone have any input on this in particular ?If you are considering taking the company's rooms, you should do a little bit of research for yourself. Apparently NOVA's "subsidized" rooms were significantly more expensive than other identical rooms in the same apartment tower. Other eikaiwas are likely doing the same. It takes no referrals or anything hard to get your own apartment. Just walk into an APAMANSHOP etc and tell them what you want. This does of course require functional Japanese conversation skill unless you have a native to help you. There will of course be some landlords who reject foreigners, but you should find something.
You mentioned that TESL training wasn't really helpful for getting the job but good knowledge to have, are there any courses you could recommend, schools or establishments that you are familiar with or the like. Is an online course a viable learning experience, such as the one i mentioned earlier?
Is there anything else I can do between now and when I apply that will look good on a resume and help me in getting a job? Or is most of their decision making done via the interview process ?
Again, Thanks for all the valuable input.
Remember that even if they aren't as bad as NOVA, all eikaiwas are out to screw their foreign employees for a profit.
Eikaiwa Schools - byakko - 2008-12-01
I wasn't aware of any company that didn't operate under the profit motive, I may be wrong but I don't think they'd last long if they didnt.
The problem is that I'm not in Japan right now, which leaves me at the mercy of having one of these eikaiwas hook me up with a residence, at least initially, to get my foot in the door, or on the other side of the world in this case.
Eikaiwa Schools - tuuli - 2008-12-01
snallygaster Wrote:If you're graduating in May, I'm not sure there's any point in applying before February or so. If you get hired, I believe they need your actual physical diploma to apply for the visa, which takes a couple of months.This was true for AEON at least when I got hired in 2002. Interview was 2 days in April and job started in October.
These companies are bashed and discussed at length on other forums, so feel free to email me if you have specific questions about AEON, but overall my experience was great. A couple basics to keep in mind
1) They arrange the hard-to-get work visa
2) They arrange the apartment (and it was cheap, I saved money while there and traveled)
3) No matter what company you work for, some schools are good and some are bad. It does seem like people at the smaller schools (smaller towns) have better luck getting along with co-workers and making friends, just my experience. Also you are more likely to get hired if you don't echo the thousands of people "who really feel like they would be a good fit for Kyoto"
Eikaiwa Schools - Jarvik7 - 2008-12-02
byakko Wrote:I wasn't aware of any company that didn't operate under the profit motive, I may be wrong but I don't think they'd last long if they didnt.There is a big difference between trying to make a profit and screwing over your employees (sometimes to the point of illegality) to do so. I'd never want to work eikaiwa unless I was extremely desperate.
Eikaiwa Schools - Tobberoth - 2008-12-02
What is needed to be hired by an eikaiwa? Is it the same as most schools in Japan IE "Oh you're from an English speaking country but have no experience what so ever in studying English or teaching? You're hired!" contra "Oh, you're not from an English speaking country... I see you majored in both English and Teaching but.... we're a bit racist so no, there's no way YOU can teach Japanese people English when you're not even from England."
Eikaiwa Schools - kokeshidoll17 - 2008-12-02
umm, im pretty sure for most eikaiwas you have to be a native english speaker with a college dregree. i actually just started working for amity about three weeks ago. what can i say? the job itself isn't horrible, but its a lot of time and energy. my coworkers are awesome, i live in a great city and have already made tons of friends (foreigners and japanese). i have a nice apartment (subsidized and cheap), i make very decent money and i cant complain too much about the company. now if i were japanese maybe i would complain, but really, as the foreign teacher i think we get pretty sweet deals.
as far as applying, i think the sooner, the better. it usually takes a while anyways. i originally applied in february and then had interviews in april, then even after being hired i had to wait about six months before i left for japan. a lot of people are sticking around and it can take a while to find a place for a new hire.
i dont think you need any special training. i mean, it cant hurt, but im pretty sure each school has a method set up that they want to use, so its not like you can just go in there and do whatever you want. with my company, we don't have to do any hard selling and even though im busy, i usually have time during the day to plan my lessons.
anyhow, i think if you don't have a set course after college, you want to come to japan and you're willing to work hard then go for it. its a great way to get here. if you have any more questions, feel free to email me!
Eikaiwa Schools - chochajin - 2008-12-02
Tobberoth Wrote:What is needed to be hired by an eikaiwa? Is it the same as most schools in Japan IE "Oh you're from an English speaking country but have no experience what so ever in studying English or teaching? You're hired!" contra "Oh, you're not from an English speaking country... I see you majored in both English and Teaching but.... we're a bit racist so no, there's no way YOU can teach Japanese people English when you're not even from England."Well, the way you put it might be a bit too drastic, but basically true. I know because I'm not a native-speaker of English. Nevertheless I got a job as English teacher in a small eikaiwa (I do have a master degree, but neither in English nor in teaching).
It's definitely possible.
My English isn't perfect, but I've met some people at teaching related training seminars that weren't native speakers either and their English (esp. pronunciation) was horrible.
Eikaiwa Schools - tuuli - 2008-12-02
Tobberoth Wrote:What is needed to be hired by an eikaiwa? Is it the same as most schools in Japan IE "Oh you're from an English speaking country but have no experience what so ever in studying English or teaching? You're hired!" contra "Oh, you're not from an English speaking country... I see you majored in both English and Teaching but.... we're a bit racist so no, there's no way YOU can teach Japanese people English when you're not even from England."People on this forum are not exactly immune to preferring input from native speakers themselves...
Eikaiwa Schools - playadom - 2008-12-02
tuuli Wrote:Very true indeed.Tobberoth Wrote:What is needed to be hired by an eikaiwa? Is it the same as most schools in Japan IE "Oh you're from an English speaking country but have no experience what so ever in studying English or teaching? You're hired!" contra "Oh, you're not from an English speaking country... I see you majored in both English and Teaching but.... we're a bit racist so no, there's no way YOU can teach Japanese people English when you're not even from England."People on this forum are not exactly immune to preferring input from native speakers themselves...
Eikaiwa Schools - Tobberoth - 2008-12-02
tuuli Wrote:People on this forum are not exactly immune to preferring input from native speakers themselves...That's completely different, for several reasons.
1. We are self studying, we don't have any teachers to correct our output. Learning unnatural Japanese is thus a bigger problem.
2. We are learning from real sources not made for studying. When you learn English from a source made for studying, it matters little whether the teacher holding the class is native or not.
3. Teachers don't give input. They hold class and answer questions. The input is gotten from the textbooks.
4. Most people here, while sticking to native sources, learn grammar from books made by professors at various colleges like Yale. Natives usually have a very bad grasp of their own grammar since they only learned it a bit in high school etc, long after they learned the language.
I've never had a native English speaker as a teacher in my life... yet I'm completely fluent in English.
Main point being, in a test like the SAT, I would easily score just as good as the average American on any part regarding English. You simply being native shouldn't give you a better chance for a job like this than me. Japanese do not agree.
Eikaiwa Schools - playadom - 2008-12-02
Of course, there's a difference between just speaking and teaching. I'd be entirely comfortable with a non-native speaker that's been certified to teach a certain language -- but I'd be very wary of a random person off the street claiming to know language XYZ perfectly.
Eikaiwa Schools - PrettyKitty - 2008-12-02
@ Tabberoth: Don't most Swedes know English or am I wrong?
It looks like they should be able to give you some sort of test and if you pass, you're certified to teach. Your written English is better than most of the people that live around here.
The only thing I can think of would be an accent problem. But the variance between Australian, British, and American English is so great that I can't see them worrying about it that much. Either that, or Japanese can't tell there is an accent. I met a Jamaican who was working as an English teacher in Japan. I could barely understand him myself due to his accent, but he was a native English speaker.
Eikaiwa Schools - Tobberoth - 2008-12-02
PrettyKitty: Yes, Swedes are relatively good at English. I'd guess that outside of countries where English is spoken natively, Sweden is probably in the top 5, maybe even top 3 countries where English is commonly spoken at a high level.
There are tests which claim to give that certification... unfortunately, it seems Japanese schools generally ignore such things. "I don't care if you passed the Oxford international english exam, you're not American or English."
I'm sure there are tons of exceptions, but from what I hear from my friends who have applied for work in Japan, it's very very common.
Eikaiwa Schools - mentat_kgs - 2008-12-02
I'd be even more confortable with a non native speaker that teaches you to teach yourself the language ^_^