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Similar codewords - laxxy - 2006-09-29
Out of all things, I am having most trouble with kanji with similar or very related meanings. Someone mentioned 訓 and 順, but by far the most troublesome group for me is 迫(urge)-奨(exhort)-勧(persuade)-誘(entice)+(to a bit lower degree) 招 and 召, and there are other related ones that I remember relatively well, like 呼, and there are perhaps more among thost I have not gotten to yet or couldn't recall now.
For some reason I don't have any problem remembering all those trees, but the abstract nouns and especially verbs give me trouble.
Has anyone else had this issue? I wonder what might be the best way to tackle it, maybe make a long story with all of them, or maybe a story in Japanese that would include a word with each one (I imagine it would be one case where catching the original Japanese connotations might be efficient)...
Similar codewords - synewave - 2006-09-29
I find I confuse keywords if I am not concentrating properly. Today I wrote 袋 (sack) instead of 俵 (bag). Partly I think it's just because I only first learned 俵 this week. Once I've encountered it a few times hopefully I'll be okay. These two also both contain Mr T which might have confused me.
I do try to review relatively quickly, in that if a story doesn't come into my head within about 10 seconds I just look at the kanji, try to recall my story, then fail the kanji. So for me it is preferable to write a kanji for a related keyword than no kanji at all. That said, neither is ideal.
My stories for the kanji you listed don't really have anything in common, so I don't have a problem with those ones. There are others I do confuse but off hand can't think what they are.
As an example though, there are words made up of kanji whose keywords could be said to be similar. I'm certainly no expert but 事件（じけん）matter+affair is one example. So confusing keywords while not ideal, is probably better than having a blank when you come to review a particular keyword.
It would be interesting to know more actual Japanese words made up of kanji with similar Heisig keywords. Perhaps that is one approach to becoming more familiar with similar keywords. From a quick look at RTK2 I noticed 損害 （そんがい）damage+harm; 源泉（げんせん）source+spring.
Cheers,
Similar codewords - laxxy - 2006-09-29
My stories for those are fairly different too, but it does not help much. Perhaps because many would still make sense after substituting another keyword, and I think it would be rather hard to create stories that would not have that issue...
I probably should just go ahead and learn a few more words with those. Really there are not many groups that are this bad, so it might just be the best way.
Similar codewords - synewave - 2006-09-29
Just wrote engrave for inscription
Similar codewords - cbogart - 2006-09-29
I'd suggest, with the abstract words, to think of a common, concrete, situation where it would be used distinctly from its synonyms. For example "solely" makes me think of a click through software disclaimer text (the user is solely responsible, bla bla bla) so I have built that into my story. "only" is kind of a similar meaning, but it doesn't have that same association for me, so I can't possibly get them confused.
Sounds like I'm not quite as far along as you all are though, so your mileage may vary.
Similar codewords - ziggr - 2006-09-29
When I fail a kanji because I confused it with another, I right-click+Open in New Tab the keyword, and immediately append "Avoid confusing {123} and {456}" to the story. Then I usually pause and ponder for a while to find a way to differentiate the two, and copy+paste the differentiating trick in both (or sometimes 3 or 4) kanji stories. Shoring up the stories right after failing them helps me know exactly how I failed them and which parts of the stories worked, which didn't.
When differentiating similar keywords, I often add phonetics to the story. It's common for two words to have similar meanings, but rare for them to share simlar sounds. So although the meanings could be easily swapped in my stories, the sounds never could. For example, I use "{732} exhort=Ex-con Willie Horton", and after one or two reviews, I never confused that with {282} urge, ever. Because "urge" doesn't sound like "Ex-con Horton", but "exhort" does.
I really appreciate the warnings from students who have gone before me. When I see comments about "don't confuse this with kanji X", I have the opportunity to factor that into my stories right from the beginning. So to the trailblazers who post warning signs: thank you.
Yesterday I wrote 吐 for "{813} split". Sometimes I need to slow down and read more carefully. Or maybe clean my eyeglasses. Or hold off on the drinking until after I finish kanji for the night.
--Z
Similar codewords - laxxy - 2006-09-30
ziggr Wrote:When I fail a kanji because I confused it with another, I right-click+Open in New Tab the keyword, and immediately append "Avoid confusing {123} and {456}" to the story.This is my "story" on persuade:
Quote:See also seduce (FRAME 86), urge (FRAME 282), call on (FRAME 495), beckon (FRAME 650), exhort (FRAME 732), persuade (FRAME 864), entice (FRAME 916).
Quote:When differentiating similar keywords, I often add phonetics to the story. It's common for two words to have similar meanings, but rare for them to share simlar sounds. So although the meanings could be easily swapped in my stories, the sounds never could. For example, I use "{732} exhort=Ex-con Willie Horton", and after one or two reviews, I never confused that with {282} urge, ever. Because "urge" doesn't sound like "Ex-con Horton", but "exhort" does.I wonder if a better way might be to learn some Japanese words with each and then use phonetics to refer to those instead. This way there is some benefit from the phonetics in addition to distinguishing the two characters from each other.
Quote:I really appreciate the warnings from students who have gone before me. When I see comments about "don't confuse this with kanji X", I have the opportunity to factor that into my stories right from the beginning. So to the trailblazers who post warning signs: thank you.I could make some of those warnings of mine public, but I am not sure about this case -- after all not everyone has this particular problem.
Similar codewords - wrightak - 2006-09-30
Check out my other thread on eliminating the need for English keywords for a method that solves your problem. I use Japanese words and example sentences as the question side of my flashcard and then the kanji as the answer. In this way, you avoid wasting time trying to remember which kanji went with which English word. The example sentence is especially good in removing any doubt about which kanji might apply.
Similar codewords - scottamus - 2006-10-02
It helps me to use the keyword in a common phrase or euphemism that contains it to make it unique from similar code words.
Like for bag and sack.
You could use "bag lunch" in your story ... but "sack lunch" is also a viable phrase.
However if your story had "being sacked from a job" (fired) you would know "being bagged from a job" doesn't fit and thus can't be confused.
For bag, you could use "someone being sent home in a body bag" which couldn't be confused with "someone being sent home in a body sack"
Similar codewords - leosmith - 2006-10-02
scottamus Wrote:It helps me to use the keyword in a common phrase or euphemism that contains it to make it unique from similar code words.Wow, this was almost exactly what I did. For bag , I used "Lek is beautiful on the surface, but inside she's a real bag" (bag is slang for mean old lady; Lek is my imaginary Thai girlfriend).
Like for bag and sack.
Similar codewords - Raichu - 2006-10-03
I don't mind all that much if I don't match the right keyword with the right kanji when they're synonyms, on the proviso that I know both kanji well enough. So I get the keywords secret/secrecy mixed up, but I know both kanji. Ditto with admonish/rebuke.
The reason I'm not too concerned (subject to the proviso) is that keywords are only a means to an end. A real kanji has a range of meaning, just like an English word. Keywords are only a stepping stone towards understanding the full range and set of meanings of the kanji.
Similar codewords - leosmith - 2006-10-03
Raichu Wrote:The reason I'm not too concerned (subject to the proviso) is that keywords are only a means to an end. A real kanji has a range of meaning, just like an English word. Keywords are only a stepping stone towards understanding the full range and set of meanings of the kanji.Hi Raichu,
In the case of similar keywords, what do you do when you want to write, without the aid of a computer? This gives me trouble sometimes.