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+-- Forum: Learning Japanese (http://forum.koohii.com/forum-4.html)
+--- Forum: Learning resources (http://forum.koohii.com/forum-9.html)
+--- Thread: iKnow (/thread-1884.html)
iKnow - Tobberoth - 2009-01-06
tibul Wrote:After 300 words I personally think iknow is doing wonders for my vocab i've never remembered so many words so easily as I do with iknow, I copy all the vocab sentences to anki as I do them so I've no need to worry about long term memory as admittedly iknow isn't very good for the long term.That means you have 20% of all your cards in review every day... think if that number persists when you have 5000 cards. 1000 reviews every day ^^
My retention in anki has flown up on any vocab/sentences that I have learned via iknow also at the moment I still cannot see why people worry about having large reviews in anki if they enter the sentences from iknow while doing the vocab even with doing 25+ new senteces I'm only averaging 110 reviews a day with just under 500 cards, although in a few week I may wish I never said this
iKnow - tibul - 2009-01-06
Tobberoth Wrote:That means you have 20% of all your cards in review every day... think if that number persists when you have 5000 cards. 1000 reviews every day ^^Maybe then I will have to slow down
either that or click easy on everything lol
iKnow - zazen666 - 2009-01-06
tibul Wrote:After 300 words I personally think iknow is doing wonders for my vocab i've never remembered so many words so easily as I do with iknow, I copy all the vocab sentences to anki as I do them so I've no need to worry about long term memory as admittedly iknow isn't very good for the long term.I totally agree. If only Iknow had bought anki and used it instead of there "learning " software, everything would be perfect.
My retention in anki has flown up on any vocab/sentences that I have learned via iknow also at the moment I still cannot see why people worry about having large reviews in anki if they enter the sentences from iknow while doing the vocab even with doing 25+ new senteces I'm only averaging 110 reviews a day with just under 500 cards, although in a few week I may wish I never said this
I found Iknow a while ago when looking for sentences about outer-space and I have watched there sentences really grow. What sucks is if you try to do a lesson, even five cards can take oveer 10 mins. I would way rather spend 10 mins with anki and knw out 50-80 cards.
Wow. I just noticed the plug in you wrote resolve. That is gonna be sweet. Cant wait to try it out!
iKnow - ファブリス - 2009-01-06
Does iKnow display ads in Japan? I'm still wondering how they make money with the website.
I imagine they need to reach a wide audience eventually for it to become lucrative. Some web apps can do with limited audience but they have a service that is very valuable and subscriptions are priced high.
What makes me think they are aiming for a large audience is the focus they have put on all the community features. I guess what I'm saying is it seems to me they know they are not going for the flashcard "connoisseur". People using Anki, Mnemosyne etc have very specific demands. But it seems to me out there there is still a majority of language learners who have never heard of flashcards. It's 2009 but the "mass" market if you will is still very old fashioned, not least of all the teachers.
iKnow - wccrawford - 2009-01-06
ファブリス Wrote:Does iKnow display ads in Japan? I'm still wondering how they make money with the website.Last I checked, they don't yet. The plan was to sell 'value added' stuff later, but keep free what's available right now.
Honestly, I wish they'd get about it because I don't want to see it disappear.
iKnow - resolve - 2009-01-06
ファブリス Wrote:Does iKnow display ads in Japan? I'm still wondering how they make money with the website.They make money with promotional tie-ins. See things like
http://www.iknow.co.jp/landing/tropicthunder
It's a clever idea - content people want to learn, and advertising people actually look at.
Quote:What makes me think they are aiming for a large audience is the focus they have put on all the community features. I guess what I'm saying is it seems to me they know they are not going for the flashcard "connoisseur". People using Anki, Mnemosyne etc have very specific demands. But it seems to me out there there is still a majority of language learners who have never heard of flashcards. It's 2009 but the "mass" market if you will is still very old fashioned, not least of all the teachers.I disagree with your claim about Anki and Mnemosyne being for people with very specific demands. Both projects have the goal of helping as many people improve their learning as possible, and are completely content agnostic.
I think it's great that iKnow are bringing more efficient learning to the masses. I just lament some of their design decisions in the review system. They have a team of people with great credentials, so it surprises me that they ended up with a multiple choice system.
Having said that, multiple choice systems are common in flashcard programs despite their ineffectiveness, so it's not like iKnow are the first to make that mistake. And perhaps they considered the alternatives but wrote them off as not friendly enough to armchair studiers.
iKnow - ファブリス - 2009-01-06
resolve Wrote:Both projects have the goal of helping as many people improve their learning as possible, and are completely content agnostic.Oh I agree
By "specific demands" I meant people who are more experienced with flashcard applications want more control.
iKnow - kazelee - 2009-01-06
Nukemarine Wrote:Brain speed is not a spaced repetition application. It randomly picks a word. It's completely useless as a learning tool, but just a bit of fun.Let's not knock it so quickly. I've found that it helps with rapid word recognition. After you reach a certain speed you have to stop sounding the words out to yourself. If the program used kanji, there's no telling what uses it could have.
iKnow - Dragg - 2009-01-06
I have to agree that Brain Speed helps out with rapid word recognition. Of course, you will usually learn to read faster just by reading more in general, but this seems to be a shortcut method to reading words more quickly in a shorter time span. I think it's fun as well which always helps.
As far as multiple choice is concerned, I have no idea how effective it is on it's own, but the official lessons test you in other ways too so it probably becomes less of a problem. As far as user generated material, I will probably always prefer Anki. As somebody else mentioned, studying on iKnow is really slow, but depending on your taste, that might be a good thing.
I generally prefer more control, but iKnow is great when I'm feeling lazy and want to be spoon-fed.
To be honest, I have never really enjoyed mining my own sentences, so again, kudos to iKnow for addressing that concern.
iKnow - mentat_kgs - 2009-01-06
Meh, the best thing to train fast recognition is to watch tv! For fun!
iKnow - Hashiriya - 2009-01-06
well, i created that RtK list to just get "familiar" with the kanji really fast, i totally agree with the whole Anki for long term memory thing... as for the Brainspeed thing, it wasn't my intention to create the list just for that... i actually tried it after i created the list and just happened to like it... just reading the stories on this site and then putting the words lists into iKnow has been a good review for me... when i do the RtK on iKnow, i just write out the kanji when i come to each one and then pass or fail it accordingly... reviewing anything in multiple ways is bound to help it stick somewhere...
iKnow - kazelee - 2009-01-06
mentat_kgs Wrote:Meh, the best thing to train fast recognition is to watch tv! For fun!LOL. The end-all.
”お母さん、頭が痛い”
”少しテレビを見てもらえる”
”お父さん、箱は重い”
”もっとテレビを見る”
”お兄さん、僕は友達あさみちゃんが大好き、よ”
”あさみちゃんとテレビ見る”
”住民が飢えている”
”あいつらテレビを見る”
That was fun.
I'm speaking more visual recognition of the word, though, which is why it would be awesome if kanji were used. Then again, it might create the situation where you're scanning an entire portion of text without any knowledge of how the words are actually pronounced.
Sadly, I've been watching the TV lately, and I've been running out of the fun stuff.
iKnow - kazelee - 2009-01-06
Hashiriya Wrote:well, i created that RtK list to just get "familiar" with the kanji really fast, i totally agree with the whole Anki for long term memory thing... as for the Brainspeed thing, it wasn't my intention to create the list just for that... i actually tried it after i created the list and just happened to like it... just reading the stories on this site and then putting the words lists into iKnow has been a good review for me... when i do the RtK on iKnow, i just write out the kanji when i come to each one and then pass or fail it accordingly... reviewing anything in multiple ways is bound to help it stick somewhere...That's interesting. With a Japanese/English list, you can't enter Kanji in that space but with an English/English one you can.
Edit: Also works for JJ lists as well.
iKnow - Hashiriya - 2009-01-06
it's because they demand a kana reading for the kanji...
iKnow - QuackingShoe - 2009-01-06
kazelee Wrote:”お兄さん、僕は友達あさみちゃんが大好き、よ”Creepy.
”あさみちゃんとテレビ見る”
iKnow - kazelee - 2009-01-06
QuackingShoe Wrote:Meant と一緒に. Not that it's any less weird.kazelee Wrote:”お兄さん、僕は友達あさみちゃんが大好き、よ”Creepy.
”あさみちゃんとテレビ見る”
I just tried to make a JJ list using iKnow. The results were... interesting.
I couldn't figure out how to get it to play a sound for the individual words. I know it's possible because I tested it with JJ list that was already there.
iKnow - cracky - 2009-01-06
They've got some Japanese-English sponsored lists now.
http://www.iknow.co.jp/landing/hiragana
iKnow - zazen666 - 2009-01-06
resolve Wrote:I have written a quick plugin which when given a list URL will automatically download the information and put it in the current deck.I get the following error:
http://ichi2.net/anki/wiki/Plugins#head-787f2b5be6f2081b6da1ce3276cb655c507cc526
An error occurred in a plugin. Please contact the plugin author.
Please do not file a bug report with Anki.
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "/Users/Nancy/Library/Application Support/Anki/plugins/iknowimport.py", line 71, in doImport
f['Reading'] = kakasi.toFurigana(f['Expression'])
AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'toFurigana'
When trying to imput this URL
http://www.iknow.co.jp/lists/28827/sentences
same happens when I use this URL
http://www.iknow.co.jp/lists/28827-japanese-core-6000-step-9
iKnow - resolve - 2009-01-06
Are you using a PPC mac?
iKnow - zazen666 - 2009-01-06
Yes
iKnow - resolve - 2009-01-06
I've uploaded a new version of the plugin for you.
iKnow - zazen666 - 2009-01-06
that was super fast-thanks. Ill check it out.
iKnow - kazelee - 2009-01-07
Thank you resolve.
Thank you for allowing me to waste hours of my life editing lists by not coming up with this sooner, assuming it were possible before.
*bites out own hair* yeah, you read that right!
iKnow - resolve - 2009-01-07
I was waiting for the OK from the iKnow folks first. It's been more than 3 months now and still not a definitive answer, so I released the plugin to tide people through until it becomes clear what is and isn't allowed to be downloaded.
http://developer.iknow.co.jp/forum/read/30074
(to the iknow folks, who are no doubt reading this thread: if you're not happy with the plugin, let me know and I'll pull it)
iKnow - zazen666 - 2009-01-07
Is it possible to use the plug to just download sentences and english w/o sound files? I want to keep studying kanji Sentence to kana/english. (The sound files I might put on my ipod at a later date though......)
-Marshal