knowing too much in Japanese class...

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Printable Version

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knowing too much in Japanese class... - Hashiriya - 2008-07-24

hey guys i have a friend who is currently taking japanese in college right now... he is way ahead of his class due to the fact that he studies more than just the Genki books and of course he is the only one in the class that has actually been to Japan and talks to japanese friends on a regular basis.... anyways he tells me that he always gets pissed off stares from his classmates everytime he talks to the teacher in japanese and the rest of the class can barely make sentences... he says sometimes that other people in the class get so mad they just walk out the classroom... i was wondering if anybody else has had these experiences in a classroom setting before? i am going to go for my A.B. in Japanese Language & Literature starting this fall but i won't be in any japanese classes until 2 more years (they don't offer japanese where i live so i'll have to transfer after i get all my core work out of the way)...2 years is a long time and the rate i'm going know i think i'm really going to piss a lot of people off haha ^_^

knowing too much in Japanese class... - alyks - 2008-07-25

I know I can't wait to go to my JP class this semester knowing the Joyo kanji list. Especially since the teacher is a native who doesn't know about Heisig...

knowing too much in Japanese class... - TGWeaver - 2008-07-25

Hashiriya Wrote:hey guys i have a friend who is currently taking japanese in college right now... he is way ahead of his class due to the fact that he studies more than just the Genki books and of course he is the only one in the class that has actually been to Japan and talks to japanese friends on a regular basis.... anyways he tells me that he always gets pissed off stares from his classmates everytime he talks to the teacher in japanese and the rest of the class can barely make sentences... he says sometimes that other people in the class get so mad they just walk out the classroom... i was wondering if anybody else has had these experiences in a classroom setting before? i am going to go for my A.B. in Japanese Language & Literature starting this fall but i won't be in any japanese classes until 2 more years (they don't offer japanese where i live so i'll have to transfer after i get all my core work out of the way)...2 years is a long time and the rate i'm going know i think i'm really going to piss a lot of people off haha ^_^

your friend needs to switch classes. he's clearly wasting his time, and if people are giving him the evil eye, he's probably wasting everyone else's.

if you're going to study japanese on your own between now and then, make sure to take a JLPT test along the way. if you have a certificate that demonstrates your level, you should be able to get into a higher level class.

also, make sure the school you transfer has level checks. if they just throw everyone in the basic japanese course, you should probably try and find a new school.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Hashiriya - 2008-07-25

thanks i appreciate the info... i didn't think about the JLPT maybe i should take at least 3 or so by that time... hopefully i could even do better than 3 but we'll see... i'm going to the university of georgia for my japanese classes... i already asked them what books they use... they use genki 1&2 and intergrated intermediate approach to japanese... but yeh i'll look into testing with the JLPT ^_^

knowing too much in Japanese class... - rich_f - 2008-07-25

I agree with TGWeaver on this-- check to see if they have a placement test. A lot of university-level foreign language departments have those to place students at the appropriate level. Saves everyone a lot of time and headaches. And if they don't, ask why they don't, because that's one of those obvious things they should have.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Dragg - 2008-07-25

I was extremely frustrated to find out that no junior colleges in my area offer Japanese language placement tests. They all require proof of completed prerequisites as well so there is no point trying to sneak in. (I've tried.) Usually they allow you to challenge a particular course for a nongraded pass/no pass if substantial notice is given, but I've heard that testing-out is often made unecessarily difficult and the process is typically discouraged by counselors.

Maybe the universities tend to have better policies, but here in California it doesn't make much financial sense to transfer to a university until after your second year of junior college... And by then, of course you were already required to have taken a foreign language class.
Anyway, the point is its too bad because a lot of times that sort of advanced student doesn't really want to be in that class, but instead, his/her presence represents an indifferent attitude on behalf of the money-grubbing school that would love to keep you in the system for as long as possible.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - skinnyneo - 2008-07-25

When I came back from doing a one year exchange in Japan I had to finish up the 300 level courses to get my minor in Japanese. At the college I went to they only had one track for Japanese so I didn't have any choice but to take it. The class was pretty divided between those who got and those who didn't. Sometimes you really were like "Have you been studying?" Not trying to be mean, but some people really just didn't belong there, and they needed more study on the basics. Everybody can learn Japanese we just don't do it at the same rate.

On the flip side some students were very good at Japanese, for whatever reason, and they could be really annoying. For example the student who corrects other students without giving them a chance to figure it out for themselves (this is the teachers job), or they want to go wayyyy beyond the material and have their own personal converation (wastes others time). Sorry if the material is too slow for you, but that's the class your taking. I never minded busting out a sentence or two but I always tried to keep it short and to the point of the material

Being a teacher now I realize how little time you have with your students. If a class is 50 mins usually I would say 15-20 mins would be speant explaining new grammar, vocab, maybe kanji, etc... and then another maybe 5-10 mins for q's and explanation. That means that if there are 30 students in the class it gives each maybe 30-45 seconds to practice with each student. If a students wants to take up 5 mins, well... That is of course an average, not every students is gotten to every class.

So basically I don't know what your friend is like, but I can understand people getting upset if he is disturbing the class room environment. Again, I don't know your friend. I think that walking out of the classroom is overreacting as well. What those students need to do is sit down and study more and eventually it will come to them. Smile

Sorry, this is different from the other replys so I hope I'm not taking the thread off topic.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - wccrawford - 2008-07-25

I have to agree with the last poster... They're upset not because he -can- speak with the teacher, but that he takes up valuable time for students who aren't already fluent in Japanese. I've seen the same thing in math classes where a student discusses highlevel math stuff with the teacher for fun while the struggling students sit there and try to get the attention they desperately need. (I've been guilty of doing this, even.)

Your friend should practice on his own time and not hurt the learning of others.

Having said that, I'm sure he didn't look at it this way and doesn't realize what's actually happening. I plan to take Uni classes soon (self study just isn't cutting it) and I expect I'll have the same problems for a while, since I'm not starting from scratch like everyone else in the class will be.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - liosama - 2008-07-25

heh
i was a little ahead when i started Japanese for my first semester at uni, of course i took this to my advantage and used it as a time saver for my other subjects so i didn't really do anything for Japanese in the semester, and i noticed the students 'catching' up.

THey didn't really say anything i guess americans have a worse temper than us aussies Big Grin

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Nukemarine - 2008-07-25

I am hearing similar problems from people on my ship taking a Japanese class. One student is just too advanced and takes up too much time on minutia. If I took the class, I would be tempted to show off. However, my time as a teacher showed me the problems that creates.

I have been an instructor for upto 15 students (electronics class) and its important to control students that know too much and those that cause trouble. Sadly, we much teach to the median to get the overall benefit to the majority.

On a similar note, my Spanish teacher said those that `knew` spanish ended up getting bad grades not for lack of knowledge, but that they were so bored they did not do the homework. Definately learn at your level.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - mentat_kgs - 2008-07-25

Yo Nuke. I was forced to do both spanish and english in middle school, but both my english and spanish already were pretty good at that time. So I ditched 90% of the classes and slept during the others.

The spanish teacher hated me and tried to flunk me, but the schools principal didnt let her. I would get a 0 in some tests, but luckly I would get allways a 10 in written exams.

The english teacher is a great guy. He'd give me extra class assignments without grading them and just required I took the written tests.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Hashiriya - 2008-07-25

yeh i will be taking spanish as my language until i get to the other college where i can take japanese... i took spanish 1 & 2 in highschool so i think i will be fine with it ^_^

knowing too much in Japanese class... - cracky - 2008-07-25

Nukemarine Wrote:On a similar note, my Spanish teacher said those that `knew` spanish ended up getting bad grades not for lack of knowledge, but that they were so bored they did not do the homework. Definately learn at your level.

This is definitely true, the same problem plagues the public education system.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - alyks - 2008-07-25

Heh, that happened to me in my first Highschool Japanese class. I had a C grade, but I was acing all the tests and quizzes because I spent time studying and not doing the dumb homework.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - revenantkioku - 2008-07-25

It's simple.
Don't. Be. A. Dick.
I had a guy like that in one of my classes, and we hated him, not because he had skills, but because he wasted our time. Don't ask irrelevant questions to the topic, don't show off in ways that waste everyone else's time, don't argue with the teacher that they are wrong during class. Good lord, how many times did people like that in my college classes think they knew everything about the topic and in fact there was just multiple ways of doing something, but they assumed anything they didn't know had to be wrong.
</rant>
I'm not saying your friend is doing any of this, but these are classic examples of people who are ahead of the class ruining it for other people.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Ryuujin27 - 2008-07-25

I had the same experience, but it was more among the group of friends who would steal my tests to see what I had gotten.

Oh well, they joked about it but no one was really mad at me... a little jealous sometimes, because I has used Heisig to learn the hiragana and katakana effortlessly. But hey, I offered to pass around the book to all my friends... only one ended up ever taking it and using it.

Then again, I was really the only one truly interested with a burning desire to know Japanese.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - mentat_kgs - 2008-07-26

But dont worry, ppl. It will end after highschool.
Now that you are learning Japanese on your own, you can learn __anything__ on your own!

knowing too much in Japanese class... - Nukemarine - 2008-07-26

mentat_kgs Wrote:But dont worry, ppl. It will end after highschool.
Now that you are learning Japanese on your own, you can learn __anything__ on your own!

There`s there other side of the coin. Many are in classes that they really could care less about. If they could get an A and never show up, they would be happy. The idea that they actually study is a foreign concept. So only time they learn is during class, hence the ones studying outside of classes are know it all jerks.

To quote form above "don`t be a jerk" no matter what your opinion on the class may be.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - albion - 2008-07-26

mentat_kgs Wrote:But dont worry, ppl. It will end after highschool.

I've been taking a Spanish evening class, and last year had someone how fits that 'jerk' model. It was gone for months at a time (with his wife in a Spanish speaking country), and when he was there would talk back to the teacher (an Argentine woman) about how she was teaching the class. Questioned most of the stuff she said, complained about teaching ANY rules of grammar or anything else, wouldn't accept anything different without having something to say about it, answered nearly every question by shouting out in an obnoxiously loud voice, had an opinion on everything which everyone had to hear, mainly being that his way was right and it's wrong to do learn any other way. He'll be retaking the same class next year for the third time, which I'm glad about (but feel sorry for the people in that class).

Talking to the teacher I had the year before, she mentioned having someone come to the first lesson of her class and left before it had even finished. But not before arguing with the teacher about her using Spanish in a Spanish class.

Although it doesn't seem to be that common from the classes (my first year class didn't have anyone making trouble, and the one other evening class I've taken that had any trouble was from a bunch of kids straight out of school seemingly needing to retake exams), it does happen from time to time.

knowing too much in Japanese class... - sailornyanko - 2008-08-19

Haha, don't mess with Argentinan teachers, they can have baaaaad tempers (personal experience).

In Mexico you're enforced to take english in private schools and since english is my mother language, I never really needed to study to pass the subject. I usually did the work in 3 minutes and slept during the rest of the class. One year in my final year of Jr high I simply stopped going to class for a while because the stupid school put me into the second highest level group in 1st year and by the time I was in my 3rd year, well.. there was no higher level left. I kinda hanged around in class the rest of the year because I got bored loitering but never bothered anyone and much less acted like a know-it-all snothead.

It wasn't a complete waste of time, I improved my HS average score because I always got 9's or better in english (sure helps counter my crappy 6's in math hehe) and improved my imperfect english spelling. Now it's quite good (albeit my spanish spelling is better because I'm a spanish spelling nazi).

Haven't taken japanese classes since like 2002 or something but fortunately I was with other beginners. I already knew some basic grammar things, but starting to memorize hiragana with other newbies and to start working with basic sentence making was nice (too bad the course only lasted 3 months.. we didn't even have a final exam!!!). Now my kanji reading has gotten from zero to a little something, but my grammar is still not all that much because I haven't taken classes since (I kinda focus too much on the kanji and vocabulary learning and haven't learned on my own that much else). Such a shame there's no really good Japanese ourses in the north part of Mexico City even though there's a lot of universities (my university doesn't teach Japanese for instance). There's some great schools in the south, but I hate the idea of travelling in the subway for 3 hours just for a 1 hour class when I'm already tired and overworked. Oh well, maybe in the future...