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+--- Thread: Complete Sentence Modifiers (/thread-11844.html)
Complete Sentence Modifiers - Lixoo - 2014-05-23
I'm currently at lesson 16 of Japanese The Manga Way and the lesson is about complete sentences modifying a single noun/word.
I get how to think with all of the examples and "rules" taken up. Except for one, where there is a complete sentence modifying a noun, that is in turn modifying another noun.
This is the sentence (sorry for the romaji, haven't installed IME yet):
Kore wa sonna yukiguni de tsuyoku takumashiku ikiru otoko no monogatari de aru
The book does mark out what is modifying what, but even then I don't get how I'm supposed to think to get this working.
Telling me that I will understand such things "with time" is just useless. I don't require to be an expert at this, but I need to atleast understand how to think.
So, my "question" would be: How am I supposed to think to understand a sentence like this? I suppose it may not be a completely answerable question, but please try to give me some tips on how to think.
Thanks!
Complete Sentence Modifiers - apirx - 2014-05-23
Shortened the sentence for easier understanding.
雪国で生きる男 - man who lives in snow country
男の物語 - story of man
雪国で生きる男の物語 - story of man who lives in snow country
Full sentence:
これはそんな雪国で強くたくましく生きる男の物語である。
This is the story of the man who lives strongly and boldly in this snow country.
Complete Sentence Modifiers - yudantaiteki - 2014-05-23
As for how you will start to be able to comprehend these while reading, it's down to context and familiarity. The sentence starts with これは; once you're reading at some level of comprehension you should already have an idea that the これ they are referring to is the story. (は cannot occur inside sentence modifiers so you know this part is standalone and setting up the topic for the sentence). So you can expect that the sentence is going to end with something like 物語.
If you start from the end of the sentence and work backwards you can see what the modifiers are, but of course when reading you want to be able to do it without having to go through the sentence twice. This is one of the most difficult aspects of Japanese comprehension, in my opinion. Fortunately you have an advantage in that your brain is already trained in your native language to anticipate what can or should come next in sentences, and in time you will pick this ability up in Japanese as well.
I'm not sure I can really answer any better "how to think," unfortunately it does take time and experience with the language.
Complete Sentence Modifiers - Lixoo - 2014-05-23
HUGE thanks for the tips @aprix and @yudantaiteki (not sure if tagging users is possible on here...)! - while fairly "obvious" tips, those things were not obvious enough for me to realise (sometimes the most obvious things aren't so very obvious...).
I seem to constantly forget to take the context into consideration, I suppose that's just due to me still being fairly new to the language.
Really, can't thank you two enough for the help. I felt so locked in place that I did not understand anything, and now I feel like I can finally move on to the next page
