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+--- Thread: Japanese kana have hebrew origin? (/thread-11368.html)
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - kenate - 2013-12-06
One theory say that hiragana and katakana have hebrew origin because there are the similarities between Hebrew and japanese syllabary. What do you think?
http://jamesjpn.net/2010/06/10/japanese-script-compared-with-hebrew/#comment-2291
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Fillanzea - 2013-12-06
There's a pretty good historical record of how the kana developed from kanji. If you look at kana writing from the middle ages, there's no similarity whatsoever to Hebrew writing...chance resemblances between languages are quite common, but if you go back to the historical record, there's nothing there.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Helltrixz - 2013-12-06
Sure, if you try really hard you can make some writting styles of hebrew letters look like some of the kana.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - ashman63 - 2013-12-06
I thought kana were derived from the Matrix movie.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Tzadeck - 2013-12-07
kenate Wrote:One theory say that hiragana and katakana have hebrew origin because there are the similarities between Hebrew and japanese syllabary. What do you think?Uh, no, there's no 'theory' that the kana have Hebrew origins. There are, however, three or four (extremely) dumb people on the internet who wrote something to that accord.
http://jamesjpn.net/2010/06/10/japanese-script-compared-with-hebrew/#comment-2291
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - ryuudou - 2013-12-07
Tzadeck Wrote:Calling them dumb doesn't dispel their argument or your lack of one.kenate Wrote:One theory say that hiragana and katakana have hebrew origin because there are the similarities between Hebrew and japanese syllabary. What do you think?Uh, no, there's no 'theory' that the kana have Hebrew origins. There are, however, three or four (extremely) dumb people on the internet who wrote something to that accord.
http://jamesjpn.net/2010/06/10/japanese-script-compared-with-hebrew/#comment-2291
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - yudantaiteki - 2013-12-07
They don't have an argument. There's no proof whatsoever for the the claim other than some superficial similarities between some katakana and hebrew letters.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Aikynaro - 2013-12-07
Isn't Jesus meant to be buried in Tohoku somewhere too? Maybe he brought it with him? :o
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - ryuudou - 2013-12-07
yudantaiteki Wrote:They don't have an argument. There's no proof whatsoever for the the claim other than some superficial similarities between some katakana and hebrew letters.He said there was similarities, and has pointed out said similarities. You reacted emotionally.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Northern_Lord - 2013-12-07
シ ツ ソ ン resemble two two eyed smily faces and two one-eyed smily faces.
Conclusion: The creators of smilies travelled to Japan in prehistoric times and shared their knowledge of smilies with the Japanese.
Okay, on a more serious note: Why are they comparing today's Hebrew characters and today's kana? These scripts have changed a lot through time. Shouldn't they be comparing the first kana with their contemporary Hebrew characters if they want to support this thesis?
It's like saying that whales evolved directly (NOTE that I am saying "directly") from fish because they both happen to live in the sea.
Which is wrong because whales are mammals that originally lived on land. Fish have lived in the ocean since they first appeared on earth. (I do acknowledge that all land mammals in turn came from the sea, but that was a millions of years before whales became creatures of the sea)
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - qwertyytrewq - 2013-12-07
I liked this part of the website:
Quote:Hitchhiking, physical / spiritual health, KJV truth, Linux, Wordpress, exposing the Illuminati Masonic Zionist Jesuit Roman Popery New World Order
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - buonaparte - 2013-12-07
Aikynaro Wrote:Isn't Jesus meant to be buried in Tohoku somewhere too? Maybe he brought it with him? :ohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shing%C5%8D,_Aomori#Tomb_of_Jesus_Christ
By the way,
aiueo ordering of kana comes from Sanskrit (that's true).
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - SomeCallMeChris - 2013-12-07
ryuudou Wrote:No, he said there's a theory that kana are -derived from hebrew characters-, and the link proposes that theory. I stand behind those who say that's just plain stupidity. (If you just point out the similarities without trying to make the conclusion, I'd say that's just plain uninteresting, but not stupid.)yudantaiteki Wrote:They don't have an argument. There's no proof whatsoever for the the claim other than some superficial similarities between some katakana and hebrew letters.He said there was similarities, and has pointed out said similarities. You reacted emotionally.
The history of the kana is not very old and is thoroughly documented. The slightest effort at looking into the origin of the kana disproves this 'theory' one way. The development of kana is recent enough that any mass movement of hebrew people through Asia would be in the historical record, and that disproves the 'theory' another way.
Actually, it looks to me to be more malicious than stupid; it looks like making a hoped-to-be controversial proposal knowing full well that it's false, just to troll for hits for advertising $$$.
Two sets of kana to work with, and the old hebrew characters don't even have a vowel sound ... of course they could find a few vague similarities, and a smaller number of similarities with modern vowel-marked hebrew. There's only so many ways to combine small sets of lines. て (te) looks like a T, maybe kana was actually derived from the roman alphabet! ... or maybe it was derived from kanji just like all the books say.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Haych - 2013-12-07
Did anyone besides the Chinese even have contact with Japan in the middle of the 1st millennium AD when the katakana started popping up?
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - yudantaiteki - 2013-12-07
ryuudou Wrote:From the link in the first post:yudantaiteki Wrote:They don't have an argument. There's no proof whatsoever for the the claim other than some superficial similarities between some katakana and hebrew letters.He said there was similarities, and has pointed out said similarities. You reacted emotionally.
"However from the chart, it seems pretty convincing to me that Japanese syllabary scripts are based on Hebrew script, and therefore would mean the ancient children of Israel did in fact come to Japan in the early part of the first millennium!"
SomeCallMeChris:
Quote:Actually, it looks to me to be more malicious than stupid; it looks like making a hoped-to-be controversial proposal knowing full well that it's false, just to troll for hits for advertising $$$.I think there's a good possibility of it being sincere. He has other posts on his site about how Christianity supposedly reached Japan in pre-written historical times but was suppressed; I think he's one of many who are allowing their religious beliefs to override their sense of plausibility. In this case I would imagine this belief is a way to address the objection of how Christianity can be the universal, correct religion when it didn't get to Japan for 1500+ years after Jesus' death.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - ryuudou - 2013-12-07
SomeCallMeChris Wrote:None of that applies. I was not taking the side of the author, or arguing for his theory in any sense. I was simply making the independent statement that "hey thats dumb!" is a not a valid rebuttal. Less valid than any skeptical theory in that link.ryuudou Wrote:No, he said there's a theory that kana are -derived from hebrew characters-, and the link proposes that theory. I stand behind those who say that's just plain stupidity. (If you just point out the similarities without trying to make the conclusion, I'd say that's just plain uninteresting, but not stupid.)yudantaiteki Wrote:They don't have an argument. There's no proof whatsoever for the the claim other than some superficial similarities between some katakana and hebrew letters.He said there was similarities, and has pointed out said similarities. You reacted emotionally.
The history of the kana is not very old and is thoroughly documented. The slightest effort at looking into the origin of the kana disproves this 'theory' one way. The development of kana is recent enough that any mass movement of hebrew people through Asia would be in the historical record, and that disproves the 'theory' another way.
Actually, it looks to me to be more malicious than stupid; it looks like making a hoped-to-be controversial proposal knowing full well that it's false, just to troll for hits for advertising $$$.
Two sets of kana to work with, and the old hebrew characters don't even have a vowel sound ... of course they could find a few vague similarities, and a smaller number of similarities with modern vowel-marked hebrew. There's only so many ways to combine small sets of lines. て (te) looks like a T, maybe kana was actually derived from the roman alphabet! ... or maybe it was derived from kanji just like all the books say.
buonaparte Wrote:May be true, but the dictionary ordering has nothing to do with the actual language. Frankly Japanese (particularly Old Japanese) has more in common with Egyptian than Sanskrit.Aikynaro Wrote:Isn't Jesus meant to be buried in Tohoku somewhere too? Maybe he brought it with him? :ohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shing%C5%8D,_Aomori#Tomb_of_Jesus_Christ
By the way,
aiueo ordering of kana comes from Sanskrit (that's true).
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - ashman63 - 2013-12-07
You know what's really amazing? My theory that after kana was derived from hebrew, English was derived from kana! Here's the (pretty convincing) proof:
あ----------> a
い、イ----------> i, I
う ----------> u (just rotate it 90 degrees)
く ----------> C
ケ----------> K
そ----------> S (flip it horizonatally, and squint really hard for this one)
し----------> ʃ (okay not technically English, but close enough; at least it shows that this IPA symbol was derived from Japanese)
た---------->ta
て----------> T
QED
This explains my other theory that the ancient children of Fuji-san did actually come to Australia (the birthplace of English) in the early 20th century.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Helltrixz - 2013-12-07
ashman63 Wrote:You know what's really amazing? My theory that after kana was derived from hebrew, English was derived from kana! Here's the (pretty convincing) proof:I knew it!
あ----------> a
い、イ----------> i, I
う ----------> u (just rotate it 90 degrees)
く ----------> C
ケ----------> K
そ----------> S (flip it horizonatally, and squint really hard for this one)
し----------> ʃ (okay not technically English, but close enough; at least it shows that this IPA symbol was derived from Japanese)
た---------->ta
て----------> T
QED
This explains my other theory that the ancient children of Fuji-san did actually come to Australia (the birthplace of English) in the early 20th century.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Bokusenou - 2013-12-07
I guess you can find evidence for anything if you squint hard enough...
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - SomeCallMeChris - 2013-12-07
ryuudou Wrote:I was simply making the independent statement that "hey thats dumb!" is a not a valid rebuttal. Less valid than any skeptical theory in that link.Well, I think we've shown now that it -is- pretty dumb. It may not be a valid argument, but in the case, it's a valid observation. Dumb. As. Rocks.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - ktcgx - 2013-12-07
ashman63 Wrote:し----------> ʃ (okay not technically English, but close enough; at least it shows that thisActually, the IPA symbol comes from the older English form of "s". You'll see it quite often in texts even up to the late 1800s/ early 1900s. For some reason English decided to have two slightly different forms of "s" running around at the same time. Printed forms of the ʃ character usually look more like an "f".
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - patriconia - 2013-12-08
Actually, I think this shows both Hebrew script and kana came from aliens.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - hornlo - 2013-12-08
"dumb" ... that's not a rebuttal, that's a dismissal
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - Tzadeck - 2013-12-08
ryuudou Wrote:I was simply making the independent statement that "hey thats dumb!" is a not a valid rebuttal.The problem is that you think you're departing some sort of wisdom by telling us this, and you're not. Everyone already understands that calling something dumb is not a valid rebuttal--you're not the validity police, and nobody wants you to be.
Sometimes there's a deeper wisdom in knowing when something is a waste of your time and dismissing it.
Japanese kana have hebrew origin? - buonaparte - 2013-12-08
ryuudou Wrote:Frankly Japanese (particularly Old Japanese) has more in common with Egyptian than Sanskrit.帝釋天 thinks differently.