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Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - Printable Version

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Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - mmhorii - 2013-03-18

This post is a troll. Reader, be forewarned.

I'm going to claim that Heisig made a big mistake in Remembering the Kanji 2. What did he do wrong? He included the English meanings for the kanji compounds, when in fact the meanings are extraneous to the goal at hand, namely, to assign sounds or readings to the kanji.

A common frustration voiced by many people working their way through RTK 1 is that they're not actually learning the real meanings of the kanji. Why not extend this even further? Once the learner completes RTK 1, he or she can move on to RTK 2, learning how to read and recognize kanji compounds sans meaning. The dedicated learner who completes both RTK 1 and RTK 2 will have the appearance of being literate in Japanese, when in truth he or she has virtually no comprehension whatsoever of the language.

This same learner could, in conjunction with a RTK regimen, learn common Japanese phrases. The meanings of these phrases is wholly unimportant, however; what's more important is to know when to say the phrases, and to whom.

The person that masters these skills will, at first glance, seem to be fluent in Japanese. But there will be something "off" about this person. Indeed, others will try to tear off this Japanese "mask" to uncover the truth. What they will discover is something more horrible: that the person hidden behind the mask is very much like themselves.

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - Stansfield123 - 2013-03-18

Hmmm, interesting...if you forewarn that you're trolling, does the thread still get shut down? I guess we'll know soon enough.

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - uisukii - 2013-03-18

mmhorii Wrote:Indeed, others will try to tear off this Japanese "mask" to uncover the truth. What they will discover is something more horrible: that the person hidden behind the mask is very much like themselves.
My greatest fear in this respect isn't that under the mask will be something akin to myself, but an angry 誤璽羅 -but without the ポーワ戦隊 to save the day.

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - mmhorii - 2013-03-19

I am troll, hear me roar.

I must have missed some key ingredient that incites people. Do I need to throw in some AJATT hate? Or is it love?

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - Zgarbas - 2013-03-19

While I appreciate the warning beforehand, I don't really see how it's trolling. Thread not closed Smile

Also, the first group of users will not appear to be fluent, they'll appear to know a restricted set of words with no knowledge about grammar or basic words whatsoever. Whereas the second one will seem awfully weird trying to fit common phrases as a response to anything. There is no mask, there is only getting sent to the gaijin corner =(.

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - tashippy - 2013-03-19

hmm, troll or not, i am intrigued about this rtk2 approach, it might finally make the book usable.

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - tashippy - 2013-03-19

i felt like i was standing between two mirrors when i read your post, op. if only we could keep abstracting and learning parts of a language in an endless preparation for native materials.

Heisig's Error: RTK 2 and the Search for Meaning - mmhorii - 2013-03-19

tashippy Wrote:i felt like i was standing between two mirrors when i read your post, op. if only we could keep abstracting and learning parts of a language in an endless preparation for native materials.
Your post and Hyperborea's post reminded me of the book Gödel, Escher, Bach. Is there a Japanese translation of this book, I wonder?

If we really weren't so hung up about the meaning of things, would that make us more likely to follow the monolingual route when learning a language? Or is comprehension of a foreign language in terms of one's native language a near-term motivational reward that we give ourselves to keep us moving toward the long-term goal of thinking completely in the language we're learning?

Ok, I think I accidentally drank my own kool-aid. Back to studying Japanese!